Re: [mukto-mona] Use and misuse of science in religions

How could the ancient Indian astrology predict the lunar and solar eclipses correctly in spite of believing that the demon Rahu swallows them? Follow the cryptic language of ancient literature, and a lot might be clear.

Sent from my iPad

On Nov 11, 2014, at 9:35 PM, "Sukhamaya Bain subain1@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 

Let me make my final comments on this thread. The claim that the Hindu religious books have in-depth knowledge of astronomy is worse than exaggeration. It is false. Those books have no in-depth or systematic knowledge. They have wild imaginations.

 

It is wrong for educated people like us to give too much credit to myths and wild imaginations from religious books, even when we agree that imaginations are needed for real innovations. People like us need to work on removing the brainwash from religious people who falsely and exaggeratedly give too much credit to what I call "primitive wisdom" in their respective religious books, and in the process stay in their narrow cocoons of stupidity and hatred, making the world a miserable place to live in.

 

SuBain

 

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On Tuesday, November 11, 2014 8:42 AM, "Jiten Roy jnrsr53@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 

"I am not inclined to take pride in some thing called Vedic math."

Look, Pal, Modi's message was for the people, like you, who are ashamed to take pride of their own heritages. When I tried to remind that point, some of you started to attack me without understanding my message. Someone even accused me of 'falsification,' which turned out to be meant for 'exaggeration.'

As I said before, Indus Valley civilization is one of the oldest civilizations in the world (5000 years old). When I tried to remind that heritage, you try to find excuses to demean them. Vedic era is ~3500 years old, it has brought so much enlightenment to people in that region, which people are still making use of. But, instead of being proud of them, you are bringing Chinese, Greek, and English literatures. This was the point Modi was making.

I know, if the same talk was given by President Kalam or Mukharjee, we would not be talking about it. So, it was not the message, but the messenger, that was wrong.

Look, when someone counter comments against mine, I look forward to learn something from it; this is just waste of time talking about something that should be obvious to all of you.

Jiten Roy

 

From: "Subimal Chakrabarty subimal@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, November 10, 2014 8:12 AM
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Use and misuse of science in religions

 

Ancient Indian scholars or (sages if you like the word) did real research on astronomy. That is what we need to talk about. I am not inclined to take pride in some thing called Vedic math. 
Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 10, 2014, at 6:12 AM, Sukhamaya Bain subain1@yahoo.com [mukto-mona] <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 

Well, Dr. Roy, I can accept that the imaginations of the Vedic stories were richer than their time. But when you suggest, for example, that "in-depth knowledge of astronomy ...... are all in the scriptural books", I find it more than exaggeration; it is falsification. BTW: Did Ganesh's body try to reject the elephant's head, as we see in modern transplant cases; or there was no such problem due to his mother's blessings? Now, don't get me wrong; I have been weak enough to think that the blessings of my parents did/could bring good things in my life; but I am not weak enough to think that such blessings by themselves could change established science.

Talking about some people being ahead of their time, I am willing to accept that Mohammad also was one such human. The problem that I see with the Muslims now is that too many of them proclaim his messages to be adequate for today's world.

Sukhamaya Bain

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On Sun, 11/9/14, Jiten Roy jnrsr53@yahoo.com [mukto-mona] <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Use and misuse of science in religions
To: "mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Sunday, November 9, 2014, 10:02 PM

Dr. Bain, the problem with your
comments, most of the time,
is that you think out of context. Here, you
are judging Vedic stories against
modern science fiction stories. Vedic stories were at least
a few thousand
years old. How much
scientific sophistication do you expect from the people in
that era?  Did you
give a thought where rest of the world was when Vedic
stories were written?

When you read something from a thousand
year old
books, you need to think with reference to that era. Just
trashing them without careful consideration, you will
do injustice to those books.  

Do you know how Ganesh got his elephant
head? If
you do, you can compare that to the modern day
face-transplant. Many Vedic stories
deal with space-travel and space-warfare. If I remember
correctly, Megnad used to fight from behind the cloud. Have
you thought about how did those
fictional ideas came to them in those days? Now, compare the
standard of the Vedic people
with that of the people in the rest of the world in those
days. Only then, you will
realize how sophisticated they were. You found some falsifications in my
comments.  What are those false statements? If you tell
them, may be I can correct myself.

Jiten Roy

From: "Sukhamaya
Bain subain1@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]"
<mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
To:
mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, November
9, 2014 7:04 PM
Subject: Re:
[mukto-mona] Use and misuse of science in religions

Here are
my comments on the quoted comments (below) by Dr. Jiten
Roy.

I see too much of conjecture, exaggeration, imagination and
falsification in Dr. Roy's comments. With the same kinds
of practice, religious people of other shades have been
making the claims that all kinds of knowledge can be found
in their religious books. The way I see them, the stories in
the Hindu scriptures are like poor quality science fictions,
based upon imagination. Compared to those, many of the
modern science fictions are based upon a good deal of
methodical thoughts, and upon technologies that actually
have been proven to work. That is why a lot of real science
and technology have their roots in science fictions.

BTW: As for Modi/BJP being a threat to secularism, people
need to realize that Modi/BJP is not like the fools/fanatics
that throw stones at the devil after praying to their God.
Even with their oxymoron of Hindutwa, they are a lot more
rational people than those who believe in the dogmatic
religions.

Sukhamaya Bain

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