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Monday, December 1, 2014

Re: [mukto-mona] A Copy of the Koran for Subimal Chakrabarty



Good points! However, it would be catastrophic if any western or eastern leader would say anything bad about Islam. One good example is Geert Wilders of Holland. He has become a pariah in Europe for his non correctness. I am sure people are very angry but they try to sugarcoat their frustrations. Who want have chaos in their own countries and beyond. The reforms need to come within but that is not happening. Probably, it would never happen in Islam. If it really happens, the religion itself might become totally redundant.
-SD
 



On Monday, December 1, 2014 7:29 PM, "Sukhamaya Bain subain1@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 
You are wrong, Mr. Chakrabarty, when you write "Selective praising is the policy adopted by all great sensible people." A lot of great people did not praise religions selectively while being silent/inactive on what are wrong with the religions. In fact, reforms of religions happened by the actions of some great souls who pointed out and acted on faults in the religions, as opposed to praising them.
 
But look at the results of selective praising by some leaders in history. Gandhi, Tagore, Vivekananda, et al selectively praised Islam. Did it make the Muslims of the Indian sub-continent better human beings? Look at today's Pakistan. Look at Bangladesh - the country is filled with religious morons. To give just one recent example, a minister has been stripped of his cabinet and party memberships and he is now in jail. For what?
 
In the West, George (little) Bush called Islam a "religion of peace." But in spite of billions of US dollars spent in Afghanistan, he could not civilize the Muslims there enough to allow an Afghan Muslim who converted to Christianity to stay in his homeland. He had to smuggle the Afghan gentleman out of that country. Obama falsely claims that Islamic State does not represent Islam. Cameron dishonestly claims that the Islamic State barbarians are not Muslims. I am totally convinced that their kind of political correctness would not help the civilized world. BTW: have you seen any of the so-called moderate Muslim leaders declaring Islamic State apostate?
 
Oh, BTW: I give money to celebrate Durga Puja in my village not because I have much respect for the religion; I do it to help some of my poor family/friends/neighbors to have a good time. In fact, I made it clear to them. They know that I am not religious and I dislike excessive religiosity.
 
Oh, well, I do not have more time for this right now.
 
SuBain
 
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On Sunday, November 30, 2014 8:30 PM, "Kamal Das kamalctgu@gmail.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 
Defending a person who exterminated Jews like insects, our Mawlana claims to be an atheist? How strange! 

Sent from my iPad

On Dec 1, 2014, at 6:01 AM, "Jiten Roy jnrsr53@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 
Of course we all live among religious people. People go to religious festivals for different reasons; some people go there to worship, others go there for socialization, cultural entertainment, etc. I meet many Muslims there as well; they are there to enjoy cultural functions. You go to puja to show your respect to your family's desire; that's not the question here. The question is - whether you will have to defend their religion as well to show that respect. I say, you don't need to defend a religion just to show your respect for people who follow religion; that's hypocrisy. You are not being truthful to yourself. I am sorry - your mind is full of contradictions and inconsistencies.
Think about what your good friend, Dr. Bain, is telling you. You either support or reject a religion; there is nothing like partially support a religion. It's crazy to think that way.
Jiten Roy

 
From: "Subimal Chakrabarty subimal@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2014 5:11 PM
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] A Copy of the Koran for Subimal Chakrabarty

 
Dr. Roy
I am a confirmed atheist no doubt and I have been atheist for the last forty-seven years. There has been no deviation. But I am respectful to people who are religious. All my relatives including my wife and most of my friends are believers. I live among the believers. I go to pujas. My wife performs rituals and arranges pujas at home. I happily live with among the believers. I am sure we all do. Dr. Bain (a confirmed atheist) who is personally known to me sends money to his village in Bangladesh for pujas. I get emails from Priyobangla from which I know that one of the most active members of the forum organizes pujas. There is nothing wrong in it. Religious festivals are part of our culture. Participation by an atheist in it does not make him a believer. 

Moreover, an atheist does not have to be a good man. Although he does not have a religion, he can pretty well be a communalist in his personal life and political life as well. 

Sent from my iPhone



On Nov 29, 2014, at 9:36 AM, Jiten Roy jnrsr53@yahoo.com [mukto-mona] <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 
"To me, Najrul. Rabindranath, Gandhi, and many other intellectuals/philosophers/politicians were wrong when they talked about selected good parts of Islam, especially when they failed to ask people to discard the parts that can be used to make the world hell."
That's exactly my view also, thanks.
We all have brains to judge good and bad. Unfortunately, some people look at others' opinions for their own opinions. This is what I see in Mr. Chakraborty. It seems like - he is unable to express his own mind without quoting others. These individuals could be pointing to some good things about Islam for political correctness or some other reasons, we don't know.   
We cannot just use some good things about something to defend it; you need to take into account good and bad together to judge anything. A religiously motivated person would only talk about good things to defend his/her religion. When an atheist do that, to praise a religion, I don't see truthfulness in it; rather, I see cowardice and appeasement in this behavior.
This is not the first time I saw this tendency of him; this has been his traits for years. He says he is an atheist, but never defends his view, instead he defends a religion. I have gone through this many times with him in the past.
The truth is - religion is not peaceful; they are all violent. So, when someone tries to prove - his/her religion is peaceful, either he does not know his religion or this is  the propaganda to camouflage the violent nature of his religion.      
Jiten Roy

 
From: "Sukhamaya Bain subain1@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, November 29, 2014 7:59 AM
Subject: [mukto-mona] A Copy of the Koran for Subimal Chakrabarty

 
I am posting this in honor of Professor Subimal Chakrabarty for the following post in which he stated, "my knowledge about the Koran is extremely limited.":
 
In this information age, learning about almost anything is possible and free. The following translation of the Koran was certified to be authentic by a religious Muslim friend of mine:
 
 
I hope Professor Chakrabarty would read it, and randomly talk about what are in the Koran. Selecting verses that sound great to praise the religion would be dishonest and a disservice to humanity, especially when too many followers of Islam, including the Islamic State barbarians, try to follow everything. To too many followers, everything in the Koran and Hadit are to be followed, irrespective of where that would take the world/humanity. (Of course, they follow without thinking; they do not have the capacity to think logically.)
 
To me, Najrul. Rabindranath, Gandhi, and many other intellectuals/philosophers/politicians were wrong when they talked about selected good parts of Islam, especially when they failed to ask people to discard the parts that can be used to make the world hell.
 
I am not interested in opening up anyone's holy book to criticize it; I want the followers themselves to try to open up their minds, to do the criticizing themselves, and to be able discard what should be discarded.
 
Sukhamaya Bain
 
 








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