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Thursday, December 3, 2009

[mukto-mona] Fwd: Fw: Re: Re: Asiapeace (ACHA) Swiss minaret ban



 
Mr Akhtar Husain, when you say  "criticism of Saudi Arabia is unfair", then,
What says you  Mr Akhtar Husain, in defense of your "KSA" your holy citadel of "good things!" and pure Islam?
 
Let's count the ways!
 
 
 
From: omarali502000@yahoo.com
To: asiapeace@yahoogroups.com
Sent: 12/3/2009 1:59:53 P.M. Eastern Standard Time
Subj: Fw: Re: Re: Asiapeace (ACHA) Swiss minaret ban
 



--- On Wed, 12/2/09, Shahid Husain <Husainfive@yahoo.com> wrote:

From: Shahid Husain <Husainfive@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: Fw: Re: Re: Asiapeace (ACHA) Swiss minaret ban
To: omarali502000@yahoo.com
Date: Wednesday, December 2, 2009, 6:11 PM

I lived in Saudi Arabia for 18 years and I know of 2 instances where Christians were 'caught' holding a service in their house and the 3 families were deported within 24 hours and the second case where a house was raided and they had a 'chapel' in one of the bedrooms and the family was imprisoned and then deported. They had worked in KSA for 24 years and they were not given their termination bonus because they were deported.

I am no scholar of Islam but I cannot believe that this treatment is sanctioned in Islam.

Yes ritualistic Islam is everywhere in KSA but not Islam the deen the way of life. I am sure some of you have worked there and know how the Saudis treat their servants and labourers.

Shahid

From: akhtar husain <akhtar46_1999@ yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Asiapeace (ACHA) Swiss minaret ban
To: "omar ali" <omarali502000@ yahoo.com
Date: Tuesday, December 1, 2009, 2:09 AM

 

*KSA= Kingdom of Saudi Arabia

<<...The criticism of Saudi Arabia is unfair. According to hadeeth of our beloved PROPHET. NO OTHER RELIGION SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO BE PRACTISED IN THE ARABIAN PENINSULA. There is no such thing as wahabbism. IN KSA* there is great emphasis on avoiding shirk and bidaat which is widespread all over the Islamic countries. KSA has its own faults but we must appreciate their good things as well...>>

-akhtar husain

 

From: omarali502000@yahoo.com
To: asiapeace@yahoogroups.com
Sent: 12/2/2009 3:42:19 P.M. Eastern Standard Time
Subj: Fw: Re: Re: Asiapeace (ACHA) Swiss minaret ban

 




--- On Wed, 12/2/09, Ghulam F Dogar <gdogar@yahoo.com> wrote:


From: Ghulam F Dogar <gdogar@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Re: Asiapeace (ACHA) Swiss minaret ban
To: "omar ali" <omarali502000@yahoo.com>
Date: Wednesday, December 2, 2009, 2:15 PM

Further to it Omare
Imam Bukhari, says, there were more than 100, 000 hadiths in circulation and he only selected ten thousands........ (whatever criterion he used) so by his own standards if a pool has more than 90 percent unreliable traditions ..... it is hardly a reliable pool anyway.
Secondly it is about "HAJJAZ" not Arab Peninsula  in which  non Muslims are not allowed .......
If all countries implement Akhtar Hussain's formula and Canada declares itself Christian country ...... I suppose we should pack our bags and head somewhere else!!!!!
gd

 

From: omar ali <omarali502000@yahoo.com>
To: asiapeace <asiapeace@yahoogroups.com>
Cc: akhtar46_1999@yahoo.com
Sent: Wed, December 2, 2009 2:18:53 PM
Subject: Fw: Re: Asiapeace (ACHA) Swiss minaret ban


Devender,

There are thousands of hadiths and I am sure Mr. Hussain can find one that says something vaguely in line with his claim. In fact, i remember reading a hadith that "two religions cannot exist in Arabia". Who knows what context and in what manner this statement was made. As you know, hadiths were collected 200 years after the fact using the system of "my grandfather used to say that his uncle reported that X heard the holy prophet say Y". This is obviously a recipe for finding thousands of statements, mostly without context and almost all without independent corroboration. Make of it what you will...
How this is interpreted obviously varies. Hardline wahabis DO interpret it as an order to keep the peninsula clear of all other religions. But equally obviously, there are many religions in the peninsula right now, so the "rule" is not being followed....

Omar

--- On Wed, 12/2/09, davender bhardwaj <davenderbhardwaj@yahoo.com> wrote:


From: davender bhardwaj <davenderbhardwaj@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Fw: Re: Asiapeace (ACHA) Swiss minaret ban
To: "omar ali" <omarali502000@yahoo.com>
Date: Wednesday, December 2, 2009, 11:40 AM

 

Omar,

 

I would like to ask Mr. Akhtar Hussain if he can quote a reference for  the Hadees about allowing no other religion to be practiced in Arabian Penninsula. What happened to sura in Quran saying no compulsion in religion? Is there a Hadees banning all other religions beyond Arabian Penninsula also or may be the whole world?

 

Does Mr. Akhtar Hussein know that there are still Christians in the Arabian Penninsula and there were Jews in Jeddah till the last century?

 

Davender Bhardwaj

--- On Tue, 12/1/09, omar ali <omarali502000@yahoo.com> wrote:


From: omar ali <omarali502000@yahoo.com>
Subject: Fw: Re: Asiapeace (ACHA) Swiss minaret ban
To: "asiapeace" <asiapeace@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Tuesday, December 1, 2009, 8:04 AM

 



--- On Tue, 12/1/09, akhtar husain <akhtar46_1999@ yahoo.com> wrote:


From: akhtar husain <akhtar46_1999@ yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Asiapeace (ACHA) Swiss minaret ban
To: "omar ali" <omarali502000@ yahoo.com>
Date: Tuesday, December 1, 2009, 2:09 AM

The criticism of Saudi Arabia is unfair. According to hadeeth of our beloved PROPHET. NO OTHER RELIGION SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO BE PRACTISED IN THE ARABIAN PENINSULA. There is no such thing as wahabbism. IN KSA there is great emphasis on avoiding shirk and bidaat which is widespread all over the Islamic countries. KSA has its own faults but we must appreciate their good things as well.

--- On Tue, 12/1/09, omar ali <omarali502000@ yahoo.com> wrote:


From: omar ali <omarali502000@ yahoo.com>
Subject: Asiapeace (ACHA) Swiss minaret ban
To: "asiapeace" <asiapeace@yahoogrou ps.com>, abdalian@yahoogroup s.com, shaheryar.azhar@ gmail.com, crdp@yahoogroups. com, Pakistan_Futures@ yahoogroups. com
Date: Tuesday, December 1, 2009, 1:51 AM

 

This ban runs counter to all traditions of liberal democracy and must be overturned.

 

Of course, the hypocritical protests from places like Saudi Arabia (no religious symbols of ANY religion other than the wahabi sect are allowed) and Lashkar e Tayaba (they actually had the gall to say "this is a blow against inter-faith harmony" [O' Really? Ha! Ha! Ha!Look, who's talking!], I kid you not) is not going to help matters. But we should apply diplomatic, economic and moral pressure on the Swiss and on Europeans in general, based on principles of freedom of speech, freedom of religion and freedom of association.

Comparison with the Danish cartoon case is misplaced because in that case the Danish were actually on the side of freedom of expression.

 

Omar

 

November 30, 2009

Swiss minaret ban fits pattern of populist protest in Western Europe

Commentary: Oliver Kamm

The Swiss vote to ban the construction of minarets fits a wider pattern of populist protest in Western Europe. Parties of the Right have campaigned vigorously against the supposedly alien influence spread by Muslim populations.

That movement should be sharply distinguished from the secularist and liberal defence of the principles of a pluralist society.

Geert Wilders, the Dutch politician who recently overturned a Home Office decision to ban him from Britain, says that the Koran is a "fascist book" and calls for it to be banned. His message consists largely of extravagant predictions of the "Islamification" of Europe.

The Danish People's Party depicts Muslim migration to Europe as a threat to Denmark's Christian identity. Writers such as the Canadian conservative Mark Steyn talk of a European "demographic time bomb" of Muslim immigration and high birthrates.

This is nonsense. Muslims are a small minority in Western Europe and their median fertility rate is declining. The secularist position seeks to remove religion from government, not to drive it out of civil society.

The ramifications of the Swiss vote will evoke comparisons with the diplomatic isolation of Denmark after the newspaper Jyllands-Posten published 12 cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad in 2005. There is no genuine analogy at all.

The Danish Government valiantly upheld freedom of expression against attempts to stifle it. The Swiss electorate has, by contrast, struck a blow against freedom of association and conscience. It should be speedily overturned.

 

 

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