Cow(not Ox) was considered holy in ancient Egypt, according to Herodotus. Oxen were slaughtered, but heads were not cooked(these were buried in earth after chanting some 'holy verses'). Killing Oxen might have been forbidden by the Hindu society in India after the Muslim invasion. Before that, the followers of Shiva and otherwise vegetarians forbade any kind of meat anyway. The Hindus do not consider Cow a God, though some might call it an abode of all the bunch of three hundred thirty millions of Gods and Goddesses. Though, in reality, Hindus have no more than thirty three Gods, initially starting with only three, one each for the earth, atmosphere, and the sky.
On Sun, Feb 12, 2012 at 11:25 PM, qar <qrahman@netscape.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> As I stated many times in this forum that, ignorance leads to misunderstanding between people and communities. I have no issues with the points made and opinions shared. Just wanted to 'Correct" some wrong assumptions.
Here is an example of hatred that is based upon religious identity, as opposed to religious belief. The Muslims of Bangladesh kill cows with a lot of fanfare at one of their holy days. So far I know, Islam does not tell Muslims to kill or sacrifice cow. The way I see it, they could follow their religion fully without killing an animal that their Hindu neighbors consider like a god.
Actually for our Eid-ul-adha (AKA Korbanir eid) is to honor sacrifices made any prophet Abraham (PBUH). Since Biblical time people have been sacrificing animals in various religions. Hindus of this sub-continent are also known for "Boli dan" with animals as well.
I do understand that, cow is respected by practicing Hindus. Albeit scholars of Hinduism at times say beef is not mentioned in the Gita and ancient Hindus actually consumed beef but stop taking it after Jainism became popular in India. Either this was adopted for religion or culture is not very important but it is essential for Muslims to sacrifice animal during this Eid.
My feeling is if conversions to Islam in the subcontinent had more love for Islam, as opposed to hatred for the Hindus, cow killing and beef eating would not have been like a religious ritual for the Muslims>>>>>>>>>> Again this goes back thousands of years and Muslims all over the world sacrifice animals (Camel, cows, goat etc) during this Eid-al-Adha.
I think we could get away with lot less "Sacrifices" during this festival. Wealthy people sometime sacrifice too many animals to show off. Only God knows true intentions and I speak based on my "Personal" observation only.
I also realize it is a difficult time for many of our Hindu citizens of Bangladesh. Overall I think Bangladeshis managed to have a balanced approach with our festivals. I think last year or year before Durga puja happened during holy month of Ramadan (AKA ramjan) and it went pretty smoothly.
Lastly there is no doubt that there are many opportunities to improve understanding from both communities. Just wanted to replace some wrong information with Islamic info (Since you were commenting on Islamic rituals here!).
Shalom!
To: mukto-mona <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sun, Feb 12, 2012 10:20 am
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] How to follow religions correctly
I agree with Dr. Das's sarcasm, "The Indian subcontinent offers a glaring example of 'religious tolerance'." I also agree to a large extent with his point on the killing, forcible conversion, and displacement of millions of people in our subcontinent.However, I would point to two hate factors, religious belief and religious identity, the latter was probably more responsible for the devastation that Dr. Das mentioned.Here is an example of hatred that is based upon religious identity, as opposed to religious belief. The Muslims of Bangladesh kill cows with a lot of fanfare at one of their holy days. So far I know, Islam does not tell Muslims to kill or sacrifice cow. The way I see it, they could follow their religion fully without killing an animal that their Hindu neighbors consider like a god.My feeling is if conversions to Islam in the subcontinent had more love for Islam, as opposed to hatred for the Hindus, cow killing and beef eating would not have been like a religious ritual for the Muslims. I would welcome any historical knowledge and correction/clarification from Dr. Das and others on this.Talking about eating beef, personally I do eat beef; we even cook beef at our home. But I would not kill a cow in front of anyone who considers the animal like a god, nor would I entice anyone to eat pork if I know that he considers eating that meat as a sin.Well, that's all for now,Sukhamaya BainFrom: Kamal Das <kamalctgu@gmail.com>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 11:03 PM
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] How to follow religions correctly
The Indian subcontinent offers a glaring example of 'religious tolerance'. In the last century, over a million killed and tens of millions displaced due to religious belief. The number of forcible conversions are beyond count. Mr. Chakravarty is not only an appeaser and an optimist who would see no evil, hear no evil, though speak evil sometimes.
On Fri, Feb 10, 2012 at 10:11 AM, Sukhamaya Bain <subain1@yahoo.com> wrote:Well, when I talk about "How to follow religions correctly", I certainly mean what should be the "practiced versions of religions." To practice religions like civilized human beings who care about harmonious coexistence of all innocent people, followers of most religions have to edit their religions and/or ignore some aspects of their religions to fit their common sense and what Dr. Roy called "human compassion."I am sure Mr. Chakrabarty and I have seen innocent people who actually have very little knowledge of their religions. They realize that their God has also created people who do not have the same thoughts about God. They could see that it would be wrong for them to hate, discriminate against, or commit atrocities against other kinds of people. These people are good primarily because of their good common sense, not because of their religions.I have no argument with Mr. Chakrabarty about good practiced versions of religions. However, "Every religion teaches tolerance about other religions" is a wrong statement if we go by what quite a few of the religions are by their books.Sukhamaya Bain
From: subimal chakrabarty <subimal@yahoo.com>
To: "mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, February 8, 2012 11:36 PMSubject: Re: [mukto-mona] How to follow religions correctly
- Both Jiten Roy and Sukhamaya Bain need to read my message on the "practiced" version of a religion. Peaceful coexistence is not a myth (exampe, Hindus vs Muslims in Bengal). Peace has sometimes been broken by nasty politics. During communal riots the members of the two different religious communities give shelter to one another. We just need to reflect on the past and the present as well.
- Religion is not a unique thing. It has infinite versions. There are infinite levels of religious belief. If you want to program your GPS, make sure where you want to go, in other words, which version of religion is your destination.
- Here you go Mr. Roy: "Whatever tolerance we see is due to societal laws, and out of human compassion." That is what I am talking about: this is the practiced religion. You have mentioned only two determinants. There are many more forces that tend to keep religions universally appealing. That helps build communal harmony. But there is always a risk.
From: Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 8, 2012 8:11 PM
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] How to follow religions correctly
From: Sukhamaya Bain <subain1@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] How to follow religions correctly
To: "mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Wednesday, February 8, 2012, 8:26 PM
I would like to comment on the following two comments:S. Chakrabarty: "Every religion teaches tolerance about other religions."J. Roy: "Most people believe in Allah in their own way."S. Bain: Mr. Chakrabarty is very wrong here. I like Dr. Roy's statement. Please see below for some elaborations of these two comments.None of the Abrahamic religions tolerate idolatry, which is a Hindu religious practice. People who identify themselves in terms of an Abrahamic religion, yet tolerate idolatry, do it in spite of their religion, not because of it. For example, many Christian communities in the USA allow Durga Puja in the churches because they have advanced enough to ignore some of the aspects of their religion, not because Christianity is not against idolatry. Enough reading and honest interpretations of the fundamentals of religions would show that many religions consider the following of other religions to be inappropriate, wrong, sinful and even punishable. I am personally reluctant to dig deeper into that. But I am sure Mr. Chakrabarty would find the example of idolatry that I noted here to be a valid one.While almost all Muslims use the Arabic word Allah for the English word God, the word Allah was in use long before Islam came into being. Thus, Muslims really do not have a proprietary right on the word Allah. When a Christian or a Hindu prays to God, he is praying to Allah. In fact the Arab Christians do call God Allah. A Hindu should be able to use the Arabic word Allah as much as he uses the English word God to do his way of praying, including what would be clearly un-Islamic. A Bangalee Muslim should have no problem using the word "Ishwar" instead of the word "Allah." That should not cause anyone to lose his Islam.Well, that's all for now.Sukhamaya Bain**************************************************"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it". -Beatrice Hall [pseudonym: S.G. Tallentyre], 190![Yahoo! Groups]()
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