China got most of its military hard-wares from Russia despite the relation was very chilly. Yes, Russians needed hard cash. While Chinese adopted an open door policy towards Capitalism, Soviets got saddled with cold war cost and poor industrial growth. As for US companies investing in China, that was basically due to cheaper labor cost and stricter environmental rules of the US and EU. Chinese have paid dearly with its massive environmental pollution and it has not stopped as we speak. So, lunch was not totally free. Lands, rivers and air are heavily polluted!
Now that many US companies would not share their technologies with Chinese and Indians, many US companies might not be able to invest in China or India. The capital might go to other countries, which might not demand any technology transfer at all. As you may know, Boeing is not ready to share its know-how with Chinese and it is making great planes right in the US as Airbus doing in the EU. Apple will eventually bring its production facilities to the US and it is already in the process being realized (an old news) .On Sat, Nov 4, 2017 at 10:56 PM, 'Khoniker Othithee' via Bangladesh Progressives <bangladesh-progressives@googlegroups.com> wrote:
US traded Soviet with China, China couldnt have this military this far own its own. I am not sure if building up China is the cause of soviet demise, but surely loss of manufacring base in US. US pays lots of doe to Philipine and others for their participation in US military cause. When India has to pay to contain the frankentien that US corp facilated to evolve.
It is not paying because, India is not in a position to protect US investment in China. Atleast, US can help to recoupe some cost of containment of China, diverting manufacutring base to India, shortchanging frankenstien.
As long boeing, ford and apple are lobbying for china, it may not be easy. Still can take away tax breaks for soucing to china and pass it as payment of containg china with high price US weapons.
-------------------------------------------- Date: Saturday, November 4, 2017, 9:59 PM
On Sat, 11/4/17, DeEldar <shahdeeldar@gmail.com> wrote:
Subject: Re: US building China defense, only to use India , tiwan to contain it.
To: "Khoniker Othithee" <khoniker.othithee@yahoo.com>
Cc: "Taj Hashmi" <tajhashmi@gmail.com>, "bangladesh-progressives googlegroups" <bangladesh-progressives@googlegroups.com >, "pfc-friends@googlegroups.com" <pfc-friends@googlegroups.com>, "Yahoo!" <ju_alamin@yahoo.com>, "Jalal Uddin Khan" <jukhan@gmail.com>, "info.bangladeshworldwide@ gmail.com " <info.bangladeshworldwide@gmail.com >, "nabdc@googlegroups.com" <nabdc@googlegroups.com>, "news@deshbhabona.com" <news@deshbhabona.com>, "Abdullah Ahsan" <abdullah.ahsan2011@gmail.com>, "anis. ahmed" <anis.ahmed@netzero.net>, "Asif Nazrul" <asifnazrul@gmail.com>, "Brigadier General Shamsuddin Ahmed" <shamsuddin165@gmail.com>, "Capt Hossain" <atlanticmarinecanada@gmail. com >, "Desh Bhabona" <deshbhabona@gmail.com>, "Dr. Kahliquzzaman M. Elias" <elias@northsouth.edu>, "Farida Majid" <farida_majid@hotmail.com>, "Hussain Suhrawardy" <shahadathussaini@hotmail.com>, "Imtiaz Ahmed" <imtiazalter@gmail.com>, "Javed Helali" <jhelali2000@yahoo.com>, "Khalifa Malik" <kmamalik15@gmail.com>, "Mawdudur Rahman" <mrahman42@hotmail.com>, "Mohammad Aleem" <aleem53@yahoo.com>, "Mohammad Auwal" <mauwal@gmail.com>, "Mohammad Badrul Ahsan" <badrul151@yahoo.com>, "Mohammed Shoaib" <shoaib187@yahoo.com>, "Muazzam Kazi" <kazi4986@yahoo.com>, "Post Card" <abahar.canada@gmail.com>, "Prof Ataur Rahman" <prof.ataur@gmail.com>, "qamruddin chowdhury" <qamruddinc@yahoo.com>, "ranu51@hotmail.com" <ranu51@hotmail.com>, "Rashid Zaman" <rzaman@comcast.net>, "Rezaul Karim" <rezaulkarim617@gmail.com>, "S akhter" <sakhter1015@gmail.com>, "Saidul Islam" <msaidul@gmail.com>, "Sameer Syed" <amsmel@aol.com>, "serajul7@gmail.com" <serajul7@gmail.com>, "Shabbir A Bashar" <shabbir_bashar@yahoo.com>, "Shamsul Hasan" <barristerhasan@gmail.com>, "Syed SerajulIslam" <sseraji99@yahoo.com>, "Zaidi Sattar" <zaidisattar@gmail.com>, "zainul abedin" <zainul321@yahoo.com>, "Zillur R. Khan" <ZILLURRKHAN@gmail.com>, "Zoglul Husain" <zoglul@hotmail.co.uk>, "S M Asaduzzaman" <dr.azripon@gmail.com>, "drtuhinmalik@hotmail.com" <drtuhinmalik@hotmail.com>
--
Your thoughts are at best very
incoherent and gibberish and you are not explaining them to
any extent that I can understand. Nixon opened the Chinese
door to take on Russians. It succeeded to isolate Russia
from China and broke it with no shots fired. China and India
are two different animals. One is ruled by commies and other
one has been having democracy since 1947 with political and
press freedom. Chinese communist party can take any decision
without people mandate while Indian system does not allow
that beauty. It has a parliament and things need to be
discussed there before Indians can take any decision. So,
please do not compare apples with oranges. Would you like to
live in a communist system with no intellectual freedom or
in a system where your opinion and thoughts matter?. China
has amassed a huge wealth but it won't be able to reach
its true potential until and unless it allows its people to
practice...the true and free intellectual freedom.
Dictatorship has its limits!
India does need to be the next China but
a determined India, which can stand toe to toe to China. If
it allows to be intimidated by China every other week...
because it can't fight back China locally or globally,
then it will have to dance with Chinese tune as Pakistan has
been doing since Americans abandoned Pakistan. Indian
economy has been doing great and it should be equipped with
effective and sophisticated weapons from US and Israel so
that it can take on China if push comes to shove. If Chinese
attacks India, India should go for a first strike without
any second thought! There is no need to follow any Gandhi
doctrine anymore because it would not yield any result in
this new world. India should be ready and capable to control
the Indian ocean to play this global game right.
As for
smaller skirmishes, Yankees and Japanese will side with
Indians! Mark my words because they are on the same boat.
Interesting read:
http://foreignpolicy.com/2017/08/07/who-will-win-the-sino- indian-naval-war-of-2020/
"So, who would prevail in
the Sino-Indian naval war of 2020? It looks like a close-run
thing.
China has numbers on its side, but India's allies include
geography,
land-based sea power, and silent partners such as the United
States and
Japan. Maybe Bambi's not such a pushover after
all."
On Sat, Nov 4, 2017 at 7:29
PM, Khoniker Othithee <khoniker.othithee@yahoo.com>
wrote:
If.you
know how to explain conudrum, all the power to you. I did
discussed with a Gujrati who thought this not so much in
interest of indian mass. And to think political party
interest aligns with greater interst of country is naive,
also doesnt explain why many political parties
increasingly spending so much money and time in campaining
to sell their platform. Is it because average people dont
understand their best interest and or getting dumber with
time.
One thing I am sure, personal preference and greed of the
piwrrful weigh on the national policy , lot more than it
is discussed in academic circle
Forty years ago, china's economy was smaller than India.
Starting with nixon, US politicians encrouge outsourcing to
china, with tax breaks. That was not exactly for the best of
US, but some corporations and china. Politicians are
sometimes against their own people for campaign money. Was
it Eisenhowet, who warned US populatation to gaurd against
its military industrial complex. Do you think Indian are
more sophisticated than US in this regardl; I dont think so.
Politicians in india can take them for same ride, if not
longer.
If US take away tax breaks from china to pay for indian
purchase ofchigh price US weapons, then you could have say
Indians are astute in foriegn policy. Indian tax money for
US defence stratagey is dumb to its core, but sone
politicians BJP and congress leader will benefit from it;
is that all of India.
My arguments doesnt fits the prevailing narratives that has
been crafted for so long, so can easily be dismissed by
most. Still thought, run by some of you for fun.
------------------------------ --------------
On Sat, 11/4/17, DeEldar <shahdeeldar@gmail.com>
wrote:
Subject: Re: US building China defense, only to use India
, tiwan to contain it.
To: "Khoniker Othithee" <khoniker.othithee@yahoo.com>
Cc: "Taj Hashmi" <tajhashmi@gmail.com>,
"bangladesh-progressives googlegroups" <bangladesh-progressives@
googlegroups.com>, "pfc-friends@googlegroups.com"
<pfc-friends@googlegroups.com>
, "Yahoo!" <ju_alamin@yahoo.com>,
"Jalal Uddin Khan" <jukhan@gmail.com>,
"info.bangladeshworldwide@
gmail.com" <info.bangladeshworldwide@
gmail.com>, "nabdc@googlegroups.com"
<nabdc@googlegroups.com>,
"news@deshbhabona.com"
<news@deshbhabona.com>,
"Abdullah Ahsan" <abdullah.ahsan2011@gmail.com>
, "anis. ahmed" <anis.ahmed@netzero.net>,
"Asif Nazrul" <asifnazrul@gmail.com>,
"Brigadier General Shamsuddin Ahmed" <shamsuddin165@gmail.com>,
"Capt Hossain" <atlanticmarinecanada@gmail.
com>, "Desh Bhabona" <deshbhabona@gmail.com>,
"Dr. Kahliquzzaman M. Elias" <elias@northsouth.edu>,
"Farida Majid" <farida_majid@hotmail.com>,
"Hussain Suhrawardy" <shahadathussaini@hotmail.com>
, "Imtiaz Ahmed" <imtiazalter@gmail.com>,
"Javed Helali" <jhelali2000@yahoo.com>,
"Khalifa Malik" <kmamalik15@gmail.com>,
"Mawdudur Rahman" <mrahman42@hotmail.com>,
"Mohammad Aleem" <aleem53@yahoo.com>,
"Mohammad Auwal" <mauwal@gmail.com>,
"Mohammad Badrul Ahsan" <badrul151@yahoo.com>,
"Mohammed Shoaib" <shoaib187@yahoo.com>,
"Muazzam Kazi" <kazi4986@yahoo.com>,
"Post Card" <abahar.canada@gmail.com>,
"Prof Ataur Rahman" <prof.ataur@gmail.com>,
"qamruddin chowdhury" <qamruddinc@yahoo.com>,
"ranu51@hotmail.com"
<ranu51@hotmail.com>,
"Rashid Zaman" <rzaman@comcast.net>,
"Rezaul Karim" <rezaulkarim617@gmail.com>,
"S akhter" <sakhter1015@gmail.com>,
"Saidul Islam" <msaidul@gmail.com>,
"Sameer Syed" <amsmel@aol.com>,
"serajul7@gmail.com"
<serajul7@gmail.com>,
"Shabbir A Bashar" <shabbir_bashar@yahoo.com>,
"Shamsul Hasan" <barristerhasan@gmail.com>,
"Syed SerajulIslam" <sseraji99@yahoo.com>,
"Zaidi Sattar" <zaidisattar@gmail.com>,
"zainul abedin" <zainul321@yahoo.com>,
"Zillur R. Khan" <ZILLURRKHAN@gmail.com>,
"Zoglul Husain" <zoglul@hotmail.co.uk>,
"S M Asaduzzaman" <dr.azripon@gmail.com>,
"drtuhinmalik@hotmail.com"
<drtuhinmalik@hotmail.com>
Date: Saturday, November 4, 2017, 5:12 PM
Hmm,
such a brilliant analysis from an Indian expert, who
can
hardly express his ideas clearly?! What you need to do is
to
study India and its politics since 1947. India was one
of
founding members of non-aligned movement since Nehru
time.
It stayed right in the middle and never let Yanks of
Russians to use its territory for any adventure. Do you
think Indian Chankyas are some how equal to low IQ
Mullahs
of Pakistan and Bangladesh? Do you think they do not
know
how to play the international game? And they survived
so
far?
Can you
elaborate your scholarly thinking in details so that we
can
understand what you are thinking and what you are
writing?
There is no syn-crony there. Alternatively, you should get
a
good reference to establish your point. From your post,
I
see a title but no beef.
On Sat, Nov 4, 2017 at
12:37 PM, Khoniker Othithee <khoniker.othithee@yahoo.com>
wrote:
China, without US investment couldnt have embark on
building
milatary at a scale, that will leave Russia at distant
thrid
in next four decades.
Now, these talk of containing it at the expense of
Indian
economy is logical, if jungal law is logical.
US companies are ramping up their investment, even when
their govt slated China as the biggest threat after
terrorism. Centuries from now, sociologist and
hostorian
will scratch their to make sense of this . Because they ,
so
far they view human race as the smart animal that
always
beats the jungle law, that will change if they notice
this
US, China relationship. Third countries like india,
where
60% of people struggling to pay for basic food and
health,
are just like pawn in this conundrum, but proud to part
of
it. No wonder, pshycopaths of ISIS had some sucess in
fooling greater mass in their domain.
--
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