Dear Ejazur
Before I give up writing further on this topic, I would like to comment that there is nothing wrong to be proud for Bangladesh. All I was talking was about self-pride. I wish to believe that all your resentment is against the politicians of Bangladesh and not against Bangladesh.
One more thing Ejazur, you and I may not like it but politics is a necessary evil. You need not to go very far. Compare present condition of India and Pakistan. They got independence at the same time. One was ruled by politicians and other was ruled by dictators. Where they stand now? Guaranteed politicians in India also cannot claim they were honest 100%.
Even, I am not against the two Netris. Given the opportunity like them, not by their virtues but by their relationship, probably I would have done the same thing they do or worse than them. I may not have any complaints against the masses who vote for them. Around 80% percent of them are anyway illiterate. But I have serious reservations against rest 20%. They are people like you and me. Some educated others highly educated. Some middle class others high middle class or high class. It is pity to note how badly they are polarized to one party or another. They shout at each other whenever they get together at social gatherings only in the name of politics. Hasina is wrong always and Khalida is right always or vice versa. Most of them are not member of any political party. Believe you me; your politics will not improve if people of this class will not rise above the party politics. You will keep on getting same type of Netas after Netris and same type of Netris after Netas.
I guess I spoke a lot and don't intend to write further on this matter.
With lot of regards
Junaid
--- In alochona@yahoogroups.com, "ezajur" <Ezajur@...> wrote:
>
> Dear Junaid
>
> Thanks for your reply.
>
> Don't feel sad about my bitterness. Feel glad. You are right - truth is
> bitter. Thats why if you know the truth you should feel some bitterness
> too. I feel sad about the absence of bitterness - not the presence of
> it. People who have some bitterness about Bangladesh have a good measure
> of our condition.
>
> Of course you know how much ammunition I have. Open your Deshi newspaper
> everyday for the month of November and see how much ammunition is
> available for anyone who wants to be bitter or sarcastic about
> Bangladesh.
>
> Yes pride comes before a downfall. Especially false pride. But why waste
> such words on me? Why don't you cast such thoughts towards Bangladesh
> and its leaders? There is too much false pride in Bangladeshi
> politicians.
>
> I would say my sarcasm is a reflection of my honesty. And I am far more
> honest than your average biased Deshi commentator. Doesn't mean I am
> great ; ) It just means that the average biased Deshi commentator is
> dishonest.
>
> Nowhere am I justifying a little personal dishonesty. Nowhere am I
> justifying dishonesty for a greater cause. Nowhere did I say I was
> dishonest. Perhaps my English is not as good as yours :) I said that
> trivial personal dishonesty does not disqualify one from condemning the
> bombastic dishonesty of our leaders.
>
> I can't remember the context in which the 3 million number was brought
> up. But its a useful gun to bring to a fight. Unless there is some code
> of ethics that Deshi political activists follow that I am not aware of
> :) I don't care about the Government's official position on this.
>
> Sarcasm is not bad. Sarcasm is demanded where there is no limit to the
> folly of government. It is demanded twice as much again where there is
> no sarcasm to be found anyway. And then sarcasm is demanded twice as
> much again where its absence affords criminals and fools an absurd level
> of confidence and security. And sarcasm is often the only way to rattle
> the cage of Bengali political activists.
>
> Self criticism is what we do in polite conversation and polite articles
> - with little or no effect. Others are better at it than me. Perhaps you
> could demonstrate some self criticism and how effective it is against
> biased political commentary - or against government folly? For me, self
> criticism often leads to an orgy of self indulgence but sarcasm often
> slices through to the truth. Thats why most of our people are silent in
> the face of sarcasm. They know straight away the point that is being
> made.
>
> So the Nethri of Bangladesh (AL or BNP) continuously declares that all
> crimes will be punished by the law, to thunderous applause. Meanwhile
> her minions steal and kill at will. Why don't you provide the self
> critical commentary on this? I'll provide the sarcastic commentary.
>
> I have not yet seen your shame and grief for our nation so I cannot
> comment on it.
>
> And now sir, duty calls. I go hunting to abuse more 'third class' Deshi
> politics and to spread the good word about sarcasm.
>
> So much for global warming - with our population we are literally
> screwing ourselves into the sea.
>
> Regards
>
> Ezajur Rahman, Kuwait
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- In alochona@yahoogroups.com, "junaid.sultan" junaid.sultan@
> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Dear Ejazur
> >
> >
> >
> > I could not like it. I am sad to see how bitter you are feeling but
> your
> > bitterness is quite obvious and well understood. Unfortunately the
> truth
> > is bitter.
> >
> >
> >
> > I will not contest when you say that you are a bigger Bangal than me.
> (I
> > wish and pray it is true also). Easy son, easy. Don't be upset. You
> > said, "don't pretend you (means me) don't know how much
> > ammunition and evidence is out there for me (means you) to use.' I
> > am not pretending because I really don't know how much ammunition
> > you have with you. (I was trying but unfortunately could not find you
> > name in any book of records). You assume yourself to be on the seventh
> > floor which you are not. Remember pride hatch a fall. False pride
> > definitely.
> >
> >
> >
> > But I am glad to note that at least little bit of honesty is left in
> you
> > to admit that you are a "little bit" dishonest. Man, nobody is asking
> > you to stop fighting against evil. Rather I will encourage you to do
> it
> > more and do it more and more. But don't justify your dishonesty by
> > saying that you are dishonest for a greater cause. That is too much a
> > politician type.
> >
> >
> >
> > About the 3 million figures I never said that it is a settled issue or
> > it is not. I only said the official Bangladesh stand. Though, I was
> > troubled because you brought it up without any previous context. Was
> it
> > time and place to bring up this subject?
> >
> >
> >
> > I don't even have the right to be mad at you. But you know Ejazur,
> > self-criticism is good but sarcasm is bad. There is a line between
> them,
> > how much thin it may be. You said that your shame and your grief for
> the
> > nation are far greater than mine. Again, I wish and pray that it is
> true
> > also.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > With lot of regards
> >
> >
> >
> > Junaid
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In alochona@yahoogroups.com, "ezajur" Ezajur@ wrote:
> > >
> > > Dear Junaid
> > >
> > > I am a bigger Bangal than you. Greatness is relative. What is
> > greatness
> > > in today's Bangladesh can easily be smallness elsewhere. I am mildly
> > > sarcastic about our social and politcial culture. I exercise
> > > considerable restraint.
> > >
> > > Don't pretend you don't know how much ammunition and evidence is out
> > > there for me to use. The nation's soul begs that the truth is hurled
> > in
> > > our faces. Your lucky ego is still unchallenged.
> > >
> > > Your argument is typical of our political condition - irrelevance
> > posing
> > > as relevance, smartness posing as brilliance. You know nothing about
> > my
> > > work ethic, how I balance life, where and when and how fast I write.
> > > Just as I don't know if you are using a yahoo account on your
> > employer's
> > > time or equipment.
> > >
> > > You consider using an employers time and server as reason not to
> > > challenge our political culture. You would make a good Deshi
> > politician.
> > > A little personal dishonesty should disqualify one from fighting
> > > dishonesty, corruption and decay on the national stage? I never
> stole
> > > from anyone, beat anyone up, paid a bribe, ruined a young person's
> > > future, destroyed a career, punished honesty, forced anyone to leave
> > the
> > > country, decimated hope, exploited ignorance and illiteracy. Our
> > > politcial parties do. I understand that this does not upset you or
> > make
> > > angry. But some kuthas like me find it outrageously unacceptable.
> Very
> > > strange na?
> > >
> > > Let me be clear. Having personal vices and personal crimes excuses
> no
> > > citizen from demanding the best accountability, transparency and
> > > performance from elected officials.
> > >
> > > So your reply to a challenge on if 3 million died is how do I know
> it
> > is
> > > less?! Brilliant defence.
> > >
> > > And you refer to my Pakistani lords?! See.. you can't help your
> > > khasloth.. Just as I can't help my khasloth :) Only difference is
> you
> > > would rather keep quiet about it but I want to shine a torch on it.
> > >
> > > Who says the 3 million number is settled? Its not settled. Nothing
> is
> > > ever settled. W|hat else is settled? Everything is swept under the
> > > madhoor. You know that. Why do you write as if I am not a fellow
> > Bangal?
> > > But you have a point - why bring it up at all. Well. Because look at
> > our
> > > everyday condition - I believe our cage should be rattled very hard.
> > And
> > > just our collective propensity to be silent on any number of issues
> is
> > > directly proportional to my propensity to be offensive.
> > >
> > > And I ask the good angel on my right shoulder, so bored with little
> to
> > > record, to take note of every deep offence I give to every
> politcially
> > > minded Deshi, as long as my country continues as it has done since
> > 1971.
> > >
> > > Don't feel too mad at me. My shame and my grief for my nation are
> far
> > > greater than yours. I am punished enough. Enjoy your peace.
> > >
> > > Best wishes.
> > >
> > > Ezajur Rahman, Kuwait
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In alochona@yahoogroups.com, "junaid.sultan" junaid.sultan@
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Dear Mr. Ejazur
> > > >
> > > > They say that some are born great, some are made great and some
> have
> > > > greatness thrust upon them. By your mail anybody can assume that
> you
> > > are
> > > > a born great. Come on stop this crap. Put your feet on the ground.
> I
> > > > don't know you are a "real Bengali" or not, though you
> > > > always portray yourself to be above a "real Bengali". Not this
> > > > time only, in the past also you have been very sarcastic about
> > > Bengalis.
> > > > One may wonder how you get so much time to write on every subject
> in
> > > > this forum. So you live in Kuwait. Some of your posting suggest
> you
> > > work
> > > > with KPC as you were writing from KPC server. Mr. Great you are
> > using
> > > > KPC server and KPC time to write in this forum. And you are
> > preaching
> > > > honesty. Typical, is not it? Not a "real Bengali" type.
> > > >
> > > > Official Bangladesh stand is 3 million died during its war of
> > > > liberation. You questioned it and suggest it was 300,000. How you
> > know
> > > > it was 300,000? Your lords in Pakistan say it was only around
> > 30,000.
> > > > And on what context you brought in the issue of how many died in
> > > > Bangladesh War of Liberation? If I recollect, it was not an issue.
> > > Issue
> > > > was how many votes were casted during 2008 election.
> > > >
> > > > And I suggest you to write less but write with sense. Work for
> your
> > > > employer during working hours. He is paying you for that. And
> leave
> > > some
> > > > job for the future historian. Let him also work on something. We
> the
> > > > "real Bengalis" have enough problems to tackle and have enough
> > > > issues to talk. For God sake don't make settled issues (at the
> least
> > > > as it looks like now) another controversy.
> > > >
> > > > With lot of regards
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Junaid
> > > >
> > > > --- In alochona@yahoogroups.com, "ezajur" ezajur.rahman@ wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > I'll have to talk in your language.
> > > > >
> > > > > If my mother and sister were raped I would talk about my mother
> > and
> > > > sister and any other victim I knew of. If your mother and sister
> > were
> > > > raped you would not even acknowledge it (after all real Bengali
> na?)
> > -
> > > > unless of course you had the melodrama and smokescreen of saying
> all
> > > the
> > > > women in the entire village were raped!
> > > > >
> > > > > The average Deshi male turns his back on justice for, and
> > > > acknowedgement of, rape victims within his own family even today -
> > let
> > > > alone back then. So don't get all high and mighty with your
> > political
> > > > use of the word rape.
> > > > >
> > > > > While better people than me are busy with poverty alleviation
> and
> > > the
> > > > role of religion and the price of fertiliser in Dinajpur I am here
> > to
> > > > deal with political exploitation by people like you.
> > > > >
> > > > > Stand your ground. Or skip away - its not like you ever had much
> > to
> > > > say anyway.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In alochona@yahoogroups.com, ratri@ wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I guess ignorance is a bliss of solitude for you ! You
> wouldn't
> > > dare
> > > > to comment like that if your mother or sister was raped , or a
> > family
> > > > member was brutally killed , then again I am wasting my time to
> dumb
> > > > narrow minded jack ass !
> > > > > > Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
> > > > > >
> > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > From: "ezajur" ezajur.rahman@
> > > > > > Date: Sun, 18 Oct 2009 09:45:02
> > > > > > To: alochona@yahoogroups.com
> > > > > > Subject: [ALOCHONA] Re: It was Yahya Khan, not Mujib, the
> > inventor
> > > > of 3 million
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Dear Alochok Farida
> > > > > >
> > > > > > A million deaths here or there is irrelevant only in a cosmic
> > > sense.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Down in the gutter of our politics, how many died in 1971 is
> the
> > > > single
> > > > > > most important question that should be answered by Bangladesh.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > We pay the price for thinking that the real number does not
> > matter
> > > -
> > > > > > because, as a result, now NOTHING matters.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The sanctity we afford the number 3 million has sanctified our
> > > bold
> > > > > > stupidity.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The institutionalisation of the number 3 million has
> > > > institutionalised
> > > > > > our crass mediocrity.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > That number props up our egos, our insecurities and our
> > delusions.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > That number cheapens the value of life and lightens the loss
> of
> > > > life.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > We cannot even begin to describe how negatively that number
> has
> > > > shaped
> > > > > > our politics and our conscience.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > There are dirty reasons why we don't talk about it. And none
> of
> > > the
> > > > > > reasons are in the context of the cosmos.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > These reasons are the very same reasons for our condition. I
> > can't
> > > > write
> > > > > > about them because I don't think the English language can
> > > > accommodate
> > > > > > the scale of political depravity in Bangladesh.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Ezajur Rahman
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Kuwait
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --- In alochona@yahoogroups.com, Farida Majid <farida_majid@>
> > > wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I try to avoid getting into the '3 million killed' argument.
> > It
> > > is
> > > > a
> > > > > > pointless argument, as if a million subtracted here or added
> > there
> > > > makes
> > > > > > a whole lot of difference. Below is a snippet excerpt from
> > > something
> > > > I
> > > > > > wrote on Genocide of 1971 two years ago.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > . . . . . . . .
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > He quotes R. J. Rummel again: "It was Yahya Khan, then
> > President
> > > > > > of Pakistan", who said regarding his ill-conceived miliitary
> > > > crackdown
> > > > > > on East Pakistan in March, 1971: "Kill three million of them
> and
> > > the
> > > > > > rest will eat out of our hands" (p315).
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > The intended number to be killed mentioned in the statement
> of
> > > > Yahya
> > > > > > is not nearly as important as the explicit aim for mass
> killing
> > > that
> > > > is
> > > > > > expressed in the bombast there. And the aim of this mass
> killing
> > > was
> > > > to
> > > > > > make "them" eat out of "our" hands.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > ------------
> > > > > > > But that was Pakistani military's neo-colonial aim. I
> > > distinguish
> > > > > > between that aim and the one that was in the blackened hearts
> of
> > > the
> > > > > > Bengali Razakars as they conducted the mass murders of
> > > > fellow-countrymen
> > > > > > in 1971. Those Razakars (and their newer versions) with the
> same
> > > > > > murederous desires in their hearts are still among us. We keep
> > > > knocking
> > > > > > over them even in this forum.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Farida Majid
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > >_________________________________________________________________
> > > > > > > Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service.
> > > > > > > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/171222984/direct/01/
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
__._,_.___
