Let me be cool and clarify:
1. You claim that Islam that you know and preach is authentic. I was referring to Tajuddin's daughter's interview (some one in this forum posted it which I guess you have watched.) She quoted many Suras from the Koran to draw conclusion that Hefajatis are not right and 1972 (the original one) was right. I just extrapolated her thoughts to conclude that she does not like Talibani Islam and Muslim Brotherhood political philosophy. In one post you praised Muslim Brotherhood and only the other day you claimed that the Taliban had some good stuff in their program. That's "how the hell Taliban, Muslim brotherhood and Tajuddin's daughter gotten into this conversation".
2. "I have said enough based on information I have on Hefazat (READ my posts!). Do I have to say something "Against them"? I have said based on what I know about them. How the hell you PRETEND to know a lot about them while you do not even LIVE here? We have plenty intolerant armchair critics here, don't need any help in this area." You claim yourself politically neutral and fair. Mr. Rahman, none among ourselves is naive. We have our own agenda. Agenda may be open and hidden. If you pretend that you do not know much about Hefajat (really! 13-point program is open to all), nobody will believe you. They may think that you have hidden agenda.
3. "I figured as long I seek to "EXPLAIN" Islam here (Tried to stay away from politics), you wouldn't be "Friendly" towards me." Why are you saying this? You have seen how I have been insulted in this very forum for saying good things about Islam and the Prophet of Islam. How do you expect that I will accept every thing you say? I believe in science and rational thinking. I will not buy your fairy tales.
4. Are you crazy or what? Why would you ask me to prove that I am an Indian agent or part of a "Fifth column"? Have I done or said any thing that brings that kind of crazy thought in your mind? Have I ever accused you even indirectly of being an agent of any party or country? You are really angry and out of mind Mr. Rahman. Be cool and talk rationally with your facts and analysis. Maintaining silence about an issue (say Hefajati 13) may not mean neutrality. You have every right to say that you feel embarassed (many of our judges "bibroto bodh koren") when it comes to commenting on an issue. Recently you are getting so angry that I am afraid that one day you will say to me,"Shut up, malauner bachcha." I have bitter experience.
5. "I said, Islamic scriptures do not endorse racism and discriminate. I cannot say the same about Sanatana dharma (Because it has codified laws/practices establishing racism). That does NOT mean mainstream Hindus are not good people. They are!!" What does the double exclamatory sign mean? Any way, you have criticized a sacred book of Hindus which act, according to you, is an anti-Islamic. I criticize Manu. You have seen that. So, I have no objection to your criticizing Hindu religion. But what bothers me is your double standard.
6. "I have prasied Ghandiji without you making any childish demand for it. Because he deserves credit for his service to all people of the sub-continent." You have missed my point. My point in a nutshell is that Gandhi and Rabindranath despite being religious were secular in spirits. Giving them credit is not enough. Follow their path: be religious and be secular as well. Shake off from your head Muslim Brotherhood and Taliban.
7. "I simple said, Islam offers system that covers ALL aspects of our lives and it has lot to offer." That is irrelevant and your personal opinion as well. We do not need to preach a religion in every argument in a multireligious society. Let me repeat my previous statement: make Islam a complete code of your private life. Do not bring Islam in the domain of politics, economics, and judiciary unless your are an Islamist. This is my appeal to you.
From: QR <qrahman@netscape.net>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, May 11, 2013 12:08 PM
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Fwd: Do we have good morals?
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, May 11, 2013 12:08 PM
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Fwd: Do we have good morals?
Now that you cannot "Answer" my post, you had to come up with "new points" (irrelevant) and personal attack!
How the hell Taliban, Muslim brotherhood and Tajuddin's daughter gotten into this conversation?
I have said enough based on information I have on Hefazat (READ my posts!). Do I have to say something "Against them"? I have said based on what I know about them. How the hell you PRETEND to know a lot about them while you do not even LIVE here? We have plenty intolerant armchair critics here, don't need any help in this area.
I have said what I felt and learn to live with it.
I figured as long I seek to "EXPLAIN" Islam here (Tried to stay away from politics), you wouldn't be "Friendly" towards me. I have given plenty of explanation but I am going say what I feel about subjects (Based on what I know).
I am NOT going to ask you to "Prove" that you are not an Indian agent or part of a "Fifth column" who wants to destroy this country. Neither will I need to get an answer from you if you can tolerate practicing Muslims. I respect your right to form an opinion and you seems to be struggling at this area. WHY?
4. Pious Muslims do not discriminate. Do pious Hindus or Christians discriminate? Do they care what is literally written in the scriptures? Think about political thinking of Gandhi and philosophical views of Rabindranath? Do you smell Manu in them?
>>>>>>>> "Bro" if you are in a disturbing state of mind, I cannot help you! How the hell Taliban, Muslim brotherhood and Tajuddin's daughter gotten into this conversation?
I have said enough based on information I have on Hefazat (READ my posts!). Do I have to say something "Against them"? I have said based on what I know about them. How the hell you PRETEND to know a lot about them while you do not even LIVE here? We have plenty intolerant armchair critics here, don't need any help in this area.
I have said what I felt and learn to live with it.
I figured as long I seek to "EXPLAIN" Islam here (Tried to stay away from politics), you wouldn't be "Friendly" towards me. I have given plenty of explanation but I am going say what I feel about subjects (Based on what I know).
I am NOT going to ask you to "Prove" that you are not an Indian agent or part of a "Fifth column" who wants to destroy this country. Neither will I need to get an answer from you if you can tolerate practicing Muslims. I respect your right to form an opinion and you seems to be struggling at this area. WHY?
I said, Islamic scriptures do not endorse racism and discriminate. I cannot say the same about Sanatana dharma (Because it has codified laws/practices establishing racism). That does NOT mean mainstream Hindus are not good people. They are!!
I have prasied Ghandiji without you making any childish demand for it. Because he deserves credit for his service to all people of the sub-continent.
5. What Americans are actually doing is not important. You have correctly said that the constitution is great and that is important. All men are equal. Can you treat Islam as a complete code of your private life and keep it away from political and economic system? If you cannot do that, it is useless to talk about the greatness of American constitution
>>>>>>>>>> Bangladesh is not an Islamic republic, it is a people's republic. I have NOT proposed anything to change that. I simple said, Islam offers system that covers ALL aspects of our lives and it has lot to offer.
Even our honorable prime minister said, she will lead the country in the spirit of "Medina charter". Basically such charter (Or the spirit of it) will ensure protection for non-Muslims and equitable treatment for all citizen of the country.
What Americans are doing is important because we learn from them. They are a mature democracy and we are not.
Anyway, lately you seems to be very disturbed (Not being your usual cordial self). If you are going through a "Rough patch", my sympathies for you. Hope you get over it soon. If this is your "Natural state", it is sad and disturbing.
Shalom!
-----Original Message----- From: Subimal Chakrabarty <subimal@yahoo.com> To: mukto-mona <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, May 11, 2013 10:19 pm Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Fwd: Do we have good morals?
1. Your authentic Islam inspires you to be a sympathizer of Muslim Brotherhood and find some great things in Taliban political ideology. Tajuddin's daughter will not agree with you. You should rather say that it is your view instead of claiming it to be authentic.
2. One may genuinely get upset if you pretend to be politically neutral and not say even a single word against Hefajati 13.
3. Hindu majority India has not included Manu's edicts in the constitution. Can you please have them as your role model and keep religion separate from the constitution?
4. Pious Muslims do not discriminate. Do pious Hindus or Christians discriminate? Do they care what is literally written in the scriptures? Think about political thinking of Gandhi and philosophical views of Rabindranath? Do you smell Manu in them?
5. What Americans are actually doing is not important. You have correctly said that the constitution is great and that is important. All men are equal. Can you treat Islam as a complete code of your private life and keep it away from political and economic system? If you cannot do that, it is useless to talk about the greatness of American constitution.Sent from my iPhoneOn May 10, 2013, at 1:58 PM, QR <qrahman@netscape.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> The reason I share information about Islam (based on scriptures) so members here can understand what authentic Islam stands for. Thus it will be easier for them to separate "pretenders of Islam" from real followers of Islam.
Just use these criteria to any political party of our day and YOU be the judge.
Some members are "Upset" because I do not play "Cheer leader" for any political party here. Which most of your do VERY well. I am indifferent because this is how I feel about current politics. Sometime I like bits and pieces of our political actions. Then I comment on it. Any "Imagination" of tacit support is just that-----IMAGINATION!!
>>>>>>>>>>> Code has been given but we don't practice it. Your adopted country says in the constitution, "All men (Human) are created equal........." at start but they did not treat non-whites equally for most part of American history (Codified law came as late as 1962 but racism is alive and well in the US).
It is not the fault of the constitution, it was the fault of Euro-American settlers (Like Zionist settlers in Palestine) not the founding fathers of America. They were noble men and Thomas Jefferson even read the Qur'an and he was inspired by it. He even threw the first "Ramadan Party" in the While house during those days.You are halfway correct about your comments about Hinduism (It is a misnomer as per Vivekananda). Sanatana scriptures has codified laws to discriminate against lower caste Hindus and others. Read Manu for more details ( I don't need to educate you on it).
As per Islamic scriptures and practices by pious Muslims, it is free of such discrimination. To me Islam is a very natural and "Logical" religion. However we have many uneducated and "part time" Muslims who abuse the name of Islam to fulfill their personal greed.
Therefore, I don't blame you for having some negative feelings towards Islam but it is the very reason I share authentic information about Islam. So at least it will help to reduce misunderstanding between our communities.
We have to work as a team, so our future generations can get along better. We have to strive to go above our biases, so our children can truly be friends and partners.
Shalom!
From: Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com> To: mukto-mona <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Fri, May 10, 2013 5:40 am Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Fwd: Do we have good morals?
Jiten Roy
--- On Thu, 5/9/13, QR <qrahman@netscape.net> wrote:
From: QR <qrahman@netscape.net>
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Fwd: Do we have good morals?
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, May 9, 2013, 5:48 AM
Who are these people? Are you talking about Hefazot-Jamat people? You must really be a confused man to circulate this link to us right now. Are you aware of the plan Hefazot-BNP-Jamat cooked privately;
cool down Charlie Brown!!
My post does NOT have anything to do with current politics. Simple ideals written in an article. NOTHING more.
There are lots of news/rumors about what the opposition done and what the government has done. Suspects have been arrested and they are under process.
I don't understand ONE thing. WHY do you keep making "
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