"In 21st century when European countries are coming together and helping each other"
That is a mere fantasy, brother. The reality has already set in and some scoundrel-countries will be thrown out from the union for having no concept of managing their own houses. The union is an artificial one and it might see its own death in few years time.
The elephant in the room of Indo-Pak-Bangladesh relation is the religion. There is no way to go back to the days of harmony that used to exist in the early 20th century. India does not want to open the gate because it will be totally overwhelmed by Muslims and drag it down to create another disaster. Sorry to say that Islam and modernity is not a not good mix. Some idiots are more concern about the religion than their material and educational progress. With such mentality, a country has no where to go but down hill. While Pakistan is a history, Bangladesh could be the next if politicians do not see the writings on the wall. Srilanka, Nepal and Myanmar will be fine because they are more secular than Pakistan and Bangladesh and Indians are having almost an open border policies with those countries (except Mynamar but that might change).
-SD
"All great truths begin as blasphemies." GBS
From: qar <qrahman@netscape.net>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, June 7, 2012 11:50 AM
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] 'ঢাকার সায় ছাড়া টিপাইমুখে বাঁধ হবে না' !!!!!
Member Roy made some good points here.
At the same time there should be some standards for state level dealings. For example during Sheikh Mujibur Rahman, it was surely a friendly country to India BUT India did not returned/settled the land locked area (Chitmahals) with Bangladesh. Bangladesh handed over those right away after our independence. After FORTY long years, we have NOTHING in return.
Another example is our water sharing condition. Regardless of relationship status, we were NEVER an enemy country to India and international water source cannot be blocked by any one country costing another to desertification. Now India is actively protesting against China for what it has been doing to us since Farakka. This is the "Mother of all problems" with India and mother India is taking forever to address this BIG concern in a fair manner.
I have spoken about killing of unarmed civilians over petty crimes. You do not kill people for stealing a loaf of bread!! India can lock people up if they cross border without VISA (Indians do that frequently as well) but killing in a peaceful border is unwanted.
Another example is broken promises by India leadership. They have worked actively to block BD products in their country. Leading companies repeatedly complained how Indian customs harass our very small export industry in India. This cannot happen without government sponsorship.
The best way to improve relationship is to have people to people contact. Getting Indian visa now a days became a irritating exercise for most people.
Similarly we buy plenty of Indian products and watch India TV but our TV waves have been blocked by Indian authority. For over a decade friendly people (Who has business ties and strong friendship with Indians) repeatedly requested to allow us in Indian market but we have been blocked without any explanation. Do note that, India is not north Korea. It does allow hundreds of TV channels from all over the globe to it's audience but none from Bangladesh. If common Indians are fed hateful information about very peaceful country like Bangladesh, how the heck we sow the seeds of friendship?
Like you I used to blame our own country for such conditions. Later on I have asked around our other neighbors (I excluded Pakistan for obvious reasons and could not get anyone from Bhutan) about their perception of our neighbor India. Without failure the Sri Lankan, Nepalese, Chinese people spoke negatively about Indian policies and practices.
Awami League was in power two other times BEFORE current administration (Which is openly friendly to India) but even after meeting all most all Indian demands, we end up with next to nothing. Our primary concern is our life line WATER and India keeps putting it off.
Our people are NOT treated with dignity by Indians and any nation with any self-respect (Except new Indian-Rajakars!) cannot be pleased with such treatment. In fact, we had this issues with the the then west Pakistan and we broke out of that union!!
At personal level I get along fine with most Indians. But at state level I watch their practices with frustration. Keep Asking WHY? I strongly feel it is in best interest of India to have a GREAT trusting relationship with Bangladesh. The kind of money Indian bureaucracy spends of defense could have been saved (Because BD never posed as a threat to India) to use to help poor Indians. India plays a zero sum game with us while having a win-win attitude could have yielded optimum results for both nations.
Today we have a very India friendly administration who bent over back wards to solve all major concerns of India. Still India does not deliver!!
In 21st century when European countries are coming together and helping each other, we see India doing it's best to bad mouth us. I strongly feel Bengalis are peaceful people by nature and never posed any real threat to anyone unless provoked repeatedly (Only natural). When BAL came to power, I was hopeful for improving our relationship with India but after three years, have not seen any fundamental change (Except a trade concession with garment products). Now if you contrast that with China and how many grants (NOT loans but gifts) it gave to improve infrastructure projects for this country, you can see the HUGE difference in approach. At the end of the day, all nations should look out for each other and eventually Bangladesh will sort out it's alliances. I sincerely hope, India will be among the best partners of BD. Because it will help both the countries.
Shalom!
At the same time there should be some standards for state level dealings. For example during Sheikh Mujibur Rahman, it was surely a friendly country to India BUT India did not returned/settled the land locked area (Chitmahals) with Bangladesh. Bangladesh handed over those right away after our independence. After FORTY long years, we have NOTHING in return.
Another example is our water sharing condition. Regardless of relationship status, we were NEVER an enemy country to India and international water source cannot be blocked by any one country costing another to desertification. Now India is actively protesting against China for what it has been doing to us since Farakka. This is the "Mother of all problems" with India and mother India is taking forever to address this BIG concern in a fair manner.
I have spoken about killing of unarmed civilians over petty crimes. You do not kill people for stealing a loaf of bread!! India can lock people up if they cross border without VISA (Indians do that frequently as well) but killing in a peaceful border is unwanted.
Another example is broken promises by India leadership. They have worked actively to block BD products in their country. Leading companies repeatedly complained how Indian customs harass our very small export industry in India. This cannot happen without government sponsorship.
The best way to improve relationship is to have people to people contact. Getting Indian visa now a days became a irritating exercise for most people.
Similarly we buy plenty of Indian products and watch India TV but our TV waves have been blocked by Indian authority. For over a decade friendly people (Who has business ties and strong friendship with Indians) repeatedly requested to allow us in Indian market but we have been blocked without any explanation. Do note that, India is not north Korea. It does allow hundreds of TV channels from all over the globe to it's audience but none from Bangladesh. If common Indians are fed hateful information about very peaceful country like Bangladesh, how the heck we sow the seeds of friendship?
Like you I used to blame our own country for such conditions. Later on I have asked around our other neighbors (I excluded Pakistan for obvious reasons and could not get anyone from Bhutan) about their perception of our neighbor India. Without failure the Sri Lankan, Nepalese, Chinese people spoke negatively about Indian policies and practices.
Awami League was in power two other times BEFORE current administration (Which is openly friendly to India) but even after meeting all most all Indian demands, we end up with next to nothing. Our primary concern is our life line WATER and India keeps putting it off.
Our people are NOT treated with dignity by Indians and any nation with any self-respect (Except new Indian-Rajakars!) cannot be pleased with such treatment. In fact, we had this issues with the the then west Pakistan and we broke out of that union!!
At personal level I get along fine with most Indians. But at state level I watch their practices with frustration. Keep Asking WHY? I strongly feel it is in best interest of India to have a GREAT trusting relationship with Bangladesh. The kind of money Indian bureaucracy spends of defense could have been saved (Because BD never posed as a threat to India) to use to help poor Indians. India plays a zero sum game with us while having a win-win attitude could have yielded optimum results for both nations.
Today we have a very India friendly administration who bent over back wards to solve all major concerns of India. Still India does not deliver!!
In 21st century when European countries are coming together and helping each other, we see India doing it's best to bad mouth us. I strongly feel Bengalis are peaceful people by nature and never posed any real threat to anyone unless provoked repeatedly (Only natural). When BAL came to power, I was hopeful for improving our relationship with India but after three years, have not seen any fundamental change (Except a trade concession with garment products). Now if you contrast that with China and how many grants (NOT loans but gifts) it gave to improve infrastructure projects for this country, you can see the HUGE difference in approach. At the end of the day, all nations should look out for each other and eventually Bangladesh will sort out it's alliances. I sincerely hope, India will be among the best partners of BD. Because it will help both the countries.
Shalom!
-----Original Message-----
From: Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com>
To: mukto-mona <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thu, Jun 7, 2012 5:41 am
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] 'ঢাকার সায় ছাড়া টিপাইমুখে বাঁধ হবে না' !!!!!
From: Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com>
To: mukto-mona <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thu, Jun 7, 2012 5:41 am
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] 'ঢাকার সায় ছাড়া টিপাইমুখে বাঁধ হবে না' !!!!!
When it comes to Bangladesh-India relationship, people refer to broken promises without analyzing the underlying causes for those broken promises. They forget that within the last 40 years' lifespan of Bangladesh, it has been mostly run by political parties that are unfriendly to India. Remnant of anti-Indian sentiment of the Pakistani-era is still fresh in the hearts and minds of vast majority people in Bangladesh. No government has taken any step to repair it. In fact, that sentiment is still a winning political strategy in Bangladesh. Every time election comes, BNP/Jamat ignites anti-Indian sentiment, and fills peoples' psyche with renewed resentment towards India. As a result, very few people actually trust India, even when it is a simple goodwill gesture, like cultural exchanges. As you know – selfless help only comes from friends, not from enemies. When Bangladeshi people cannot trust the lone country that fought alongside them for the independence of their motherland, who do you blame? If we blame anybody, it should be us, not India. You should not forget, there would be no Bangladesh without Indian help. Please don't tell me now - India did it for their own interest; I know that. That's how it works. Otherwise, why would they risk their lives and resources? I am talking about trust-deficit here. Bangladesh is nowhere near to establish a friendly relationship with India because of trust deficit. Therefore, let's stop those emotional talks about big-brotherly love and broken promises, and analyze the situation critically. We need psychiatric help to repair our collective psyche, before we take any step towards normalizing relationship with India. India is trying to build Tipaimukh barrage for their own interest and need. Should there be a concern for Bangladesh? The answer is YES or NO, depending on whether India considers Bangladesh as a friendly country or not. That's a conundrum even Bangladesh doesn't know how to solve, let alone India. Jiten Roy --- On Tue, 6/5/12, Shah Deeldar <shahdeeldar@yahoo.com> wrote:
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