1. Yes, everything is a jungle, and there is no absoluteness or divinity in any of them. We have to pick and choose. 2. Religion is somehow or other involved in most recent conflicts. What I referred to by this statement is – where there is division, there is conflict and rivalry, and religion caused major divisions of humankind. Of course, there are other factors for divisions, such as race, color, etc., which are natural, and nothing we could do to prevent them. I am talking about divisions that are man-made. 3. You are living without religion just fine. We are not talking about most people also. Major changes have been made by only a handful of people. Rabindra Nath did not care about what others are thinking before expressing his own. He only hoped - others will like his views. I am no Rabindra Nath, if you are thinking about it; but, I happened to agree with that notion. You, on the other hand, try to be politically correct. As a result, you worry what other are thinking or saying before you express your views on anything. You are right - God still exists in me, even though I do not follow any religion. 4. Yes, I agree - corruption is not a monopoly of religious people only. That's not the point. I gave that example only to debunk the notion that religion brings morality in people. That's all. Jiten Roy
--- On Wed, 8/15/12, subimal chakrabarty <subimal@yahoo.com> wrote:
From: subimal chakrabarty <subimal@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Condemning Mumbai Violence
To: "mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Wednesday, August 15, 2012, 10:25 AM
1. Is the entire body of economic knowledge (or any other ideology) not a jungle? Are we all picking the same fruits? 2. A careful study of the statistics shows that "most of the evils that are happening around the world are somehow or other due to the religious divisions among us" is not right. 3. Man cannot live by science and technology alone. Many--- looks like most of the people---need a religion of a certain version. I understand you are not an atheist like me; you have a God. 4. Corruption (of all sorts) is not a monopoly of the religious people. Atheists also have fair share in it.
From: Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2012 7:27 PM
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Condemning Mumbai Violence
| I agree mostly. Religion is like a jungle; one can find delicious as well poisonous fruits there. The problem is - there is no guarantee that everyone will always pick the delicious fruits. This is what's going on with the religion. Some people are picking poisonous fruits either advertently or inadvertently. The deliberate use of poisonous fruits (of religion) is causing havoc around the world, and it is not decreasing; it's being used increasingly to settle religious group rivalries across religious boundaries or even within the same religious boundary. I am convinced that – most of the evils that are happening around the world are somehow or other due to the religious divisions among us, irrespective of how good religious principles are. It's because – where there is division, there is competition and rivalry. This is one of our instinctive characteristics. You may keep it dormant for a while through proper education and training, but can't eliminate it. I criticize religion for its very existence in this day and age, not because it has nothing good to offer anymore. After the scientific renaissance, science took over our lives and religion lost its utility. Morality in our lives comes from societal demands and environment. The populace in Bangladesh is devoutly religious, yet Bangladesh is one of the most corrupt countries in the world. Jiten Roy --- On Tue, 8/14/12, qar <qrahman@netscape.net> wrote:
From: qar <qrahman@netscape.net>
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Condemning Mumbai Violence
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, August 14, 2012, 10:03 AM
Some people are just reacting to what religion is feeding to them. Obviously, not everybody will react to the same extent, but - some will. Don't blame them for reacting.
>>>>>>>>>> I think sometime religion looks "Bad" because we "Selectively" follow some ideas and don't follow others. For example, Bangladeshi Muslims are pretty big on "Showing" they are Muslims, when it benefits them. However you check on most of them if they paid, obligatory charity (Zakat) or made sacrifices to make an honest living (Halal income), you will see plenty of hypocrites.
I have seen plenty of Muslims, foaming their mouth about their "Rights" but not so eager to worry about their "Responsibilities". Which is the very reason why "Religion" looks bad to many of us (Muslims and non-Muslims alike). When I look back to teachings of prophet Muhammad (PBUH), he was more worried about his responsibilities and often "forgave" others when it came to his rights over them (Muslims and non-Muslim alike). Most Muslims don't follow it and those who do, they don't make headlines.
This is the "Root cause" of problems we see when it comes to religion. So in one word, we are greedy and often we prefer money/power over God.
Shalom!
-----Original Message----- From: Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com> To: mukto-mona <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sun, Aug 12, 2012 9:56 pm Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Condemning Mumbai Violence
Most religious people are either unwise or fake. They are unwise because they can't visualize the evil done on earth by what religion. All they need to do is - look around the world with open eyes and minds, but – they can't. I know – people will still say – religion is not to blame; it's the people, the so called misguided religious fundamentalists, to blame. That's hogwash; I don't blame anybody, but religion, for this. Some people are just reacting to what religion is feeding to them. Obviously, not everybody will react to the same extent, but - some will. Don't blame them for reacting. So, please - no more blame, excuses, and double talks; try to analyze the root cause, if you can, and try to expose all evils of religion on humanity. Also, please don't tell me that some big-shot said - religion is the 'shuva-sanskar,' on earth, because I have seen enough of those shuvo-sanskars by now already. Don't show me anymore. Jiten Roy
From: ram puniyani <jhang45@yahoo.com>
Subject: [mukto-mona] Condemning Mumbai Violence
To: "Ram Puniyani" <ram.puniyani@gmail.com>
Date: Sunday, August 12, 2012, 1:24 AM
Condemnation of Attack on Media in Mumbai We strongly and unequivocally condemn the attack on media in Mumbai by a section of people gathered at the Azad maidan to protest the violence in Assam and Burma. Using violence in a protest against violence is an insult to the suffering victims in whose support the protest was purportedly organised. There are many non violent and democratic ways to communicate and protest any grievances, including against the media. This mindless and shameful action by a few misguided individuals discredits protest and becomes a disservice to a cause. We offer our solidarity with media; sympathy with all those injured and wish for their quick recovery. We urge the government to take immediate and exemplary action against the guilty. We also appeal to all citizens not to get swayed by this isolated and dastardly incidence and allow the situation to become a cause of conflict. Any communalisation of the situation will be harmful for everyone and totally against the interests of the nation. Lalita Ramdas- Ali Bagh Mazher Hussain – Hyderabad Admiral L. Ramdas- Ali Bagh Mahesh Bhatt- Mumbai Ram Punyani- Mumbai Kamla Bhasin- Delhi Sandeep Panday- Lucknow Jatin Desai- Mumbai
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