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Friday, October 19, 2012

Re: [mukto-mona] Shiite-Sunni-Ahmadiyya



The Shiites were originally the followers of Zarathusthra.  After the fall of Persia during the Caliphate of Umar bin Khattab, they accepted Islam with Ali bin Abu Talib as their Caliph.  While the Sunnis accept all four Caliphs as 'rightly guided', the Shiites accept only one.  "It looks like fighting over small things."- Not so, age old differences in faith and nationality are hidden it.  For example, the Sufis originally belonged to the cult of Sophia till the Arabian conquest of them.  Let the factions fight each other to the end of nonsensical religious influence of human society.

On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 9:04 AM, Subimal Chakrabarty <subimal@yahoo.com> wrote:
 

If loudness of screaming were the deciding factor, the world would have been safer. Rather it is the ego and the resulting fanatical militancy that is creating havoc. Shiite mosques, processions and gatherings are frequently being bombarded even in Shiite majority countries in the name of ensuring purity of Islam. What a madness! To me it looks like fighting over small things. 


Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 18, 2012, at 7:53 PM, Shah Deeldar <shahdeeldar@yahoo.com> wrote:

 

Brother, it basically boils down to who can scream louder. Even Shias might not be considered as true Muslims according to some idiots and hence, they can be legitimate target for elimination. Look, Islam has taken a totally wrong path. It wants to purify itself from something that might not be even pure? Sad to say that it has totally failed to deliver anything to its followers in its own backyards. Muslims are migrating in droves to the West that they hate so much. Isn't it paradoxical?
-SD 

 
"All great truths begin as blasphemies." GBS

From: Subimal Chakrabarty <subimal@yahoo.com>
To: "mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2012 9:08 AM
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] : Shah Abdul Hannan--রামু, সাম্প্রদায়িকতা ও অসাম্প্রদায়িকতা ---Ramu, Communalism and Noncommunalism

 
Mr. Rahman
Interesting. So Ahmadiyaas do not recite or believe in "La ilaha illalahu .,,,,."! I know I messed up. But you know which sura I am talking about. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 16, 2012, at 2:42 PM, qar <qrahman@netscape.net> wrote:

 
We have discussed the Ahmedi issue before. I think this issue has very simple solution. As citizens of this country, they deserve full protection of the state in practicing their faith. As far as if they are Muslims or not, it is not very important to me (At personal level). HOWEVER, do understand that, there are some fundamental differences between mainstream "Islamic ideology" and what is preached and practiced by Ahmedi groups.

Like member Shubimal, I know people from this group and have no personal issues with them. As Muslims it is a per-condition to have faith in "One unseen God" and His "Last messenger Muhammad (PBUH)". This is part of our "Shahada" and fundamental issue of the faith.

Ahmedi followers do agree with One God but they also feel like there are other messengers after "The last messenger of God". They have some different narrative about how Jesus left this world and how they perform Namaz.

I strongly believe in freedom of picking any faith of our choices and Ahmedi group should be protected by this value from any violence. If someone has an issue with them claiming "Muslim", they can file a case against it to examine the claim.

My personal feeling is, we can have a win-win solution by calling them "Ahmedi-Muslim". That way rest of the world would know what they stand for and will not confuse them with "Islam preached by prophet Muhammad (PBUH)" and they will retain the right to have a claim as "Muslims".

Once upon a time, I have a very detail discussion/debate on the issue with one of their members and he agreed with my point of view. Since there are "Fundamental" differences between "Islam practiced by 1.7 billion Muslims" and what "Ahmedi" group follows and preaches.

A simple "Truth in labeling" concept can satisfy both parties and I strongly oppose any violence against such groups. This attitude of picking up laws in our own hands is NOT an Islamic concept. We have media, we have cyberspace and we have court system to sort it out. NO need to attack any places of worship or any followers of that group.

Since we do have many "Common grounds", we can work as "Partners" like we do with Christians, Hindus, Jews, etc.

Those from non-Muslim back ground probably do not know these finer details and violence (Pakistani style) does not help it either.

There are some merit to those who question of Ahmedi followers should be considered as Muslims or not, however there is NO reason to resort to violence over it.

It is counter productive and UN-Islamic. All differences should be settled by discussing the problem.


Shalom!


-----Original Message-----
From: Subimal Chakrabarty <subimal@yahoo.com>
To: mukto-mona <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tue, Oct 16, 2012 10:39 am
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] : Shah Abdul Hannan--রামু, সাম্প্রদায়িকতা ও অসাম্প্রদায়িকতা ---Ramu, Communalism and Noncommunalism

 
The father of Jamaat Islami Mowdudi was tried for instigating anti-Ahmadi riot in Pakistan. Several years ago there were troubles in Bangladesh too. The State of Pakistan declared the Ahmadies non-Muslims. I am sure Jamaat Islami and other so called Islam Pasand parties gave strong support to the move by the Pakistani govt. Denial of Jamaat Islami involvement on this will be big lie. I have Muslim friends belonging to the Ahmadi sect. I know how much proud they are to be identified as Muslims. Why should the State, Islamic clerics and Jamaat Islami decide their religious identity? Any way with the kind of ideological belief and mindset you have you guys will make life of these people unsafe. 
A secular and democratic country tries to allow maximum individual rights. It also includes all the great and universal teachings from all religions and cultures. A State does not need to be religious explicitly. A religious State I'd divisive which is not good for world peace and progress. 
I will be looking forward to hearing from you more on this issue. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 14, 2012, at 11:01 AM, "S A Hannan" <sahannan@sonarbangladesh.com> wrote:

 
Ahmadies are non-Muslims whether they are declared to be so by the state or not..Jamaat Islami has nothing on Ahmadi issue in the manifesto of theirs.
I think basic Hindu code is what Bed has taught. As for Christians, it is the moral lessons preached by Jesus found in four gospels.
 
Shah Abdul Hannan
 

From: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com [mailto:mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Subimal Chakrabarty
Sent: Sunday, October 14, 2012 7:41 PM
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Cc: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] : Shah Abdul Hannan--
রামু, সাম্প্রদায়িকতা অসাম্প্রদায়িকতা ---Ramu, Communalism and Noncommunalism
 
 
I have humble questions for Mr. Hannan. If Jamaat-i-Islam comes to power in Bangladesh, will they try to declare the Ahamadiyas non-Muslims? What is Indian constitution lacking now and how can these lackings be fixed by Hindu religious teachings? What Hindu religious teachings has he in his mind? Caste-ism or teachings of Manu? What are the Christian moral codes that the Christians in the West are not following? No abortion at all? 

Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 13, 2012, at 10:06 AM, Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com> wrote:
 
Mr. Hannan,
I heard from many others before, but - you are consistent in your views; that's quite interesting.
Thanks.
Jiten Roy
--- On Fri, 10/12/12, S A Hannan <sahannan@sonarbangladesh.com> wrote:

From: S A Hannan <sahannan@sonarbangladesh.com>
Subject: FW: [mukto-mona] : Shah Abdul Hannan--
রামু, সাম্প্রদায়িকতা অসাম্প্রদায়িকতা ---Ramu, Communalism and Noncommunalism
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Date: Friday, October 12, 2012, 11:46 PM
 
correcyed
 

From: S A Hannan [mailto:sahannan@sonarbangladesh.com]
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2012 11:52 AM
To: ' mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com '
Subject: RE: [mukto-mona] : Shah Abdul Hannan--
রামু, সাম্প্রদায়িকতা





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Re: [mukto-mona] Re: Conflicting accounts towards NY terrorist



Which part of Ms. Mazid's comments do you like? Why this sudden love Ms. Mazid? Actually, Ms. Majid is wrong about Republican favoring Jamatis in Bangladesh. That would be too simplistic! Republicans would go for American national and Jewish interests, period. Make no mistake that Indians will be dictating the American policy in South Asia. If Romney wins, take this post to the bank!
-SD

On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 8:16 PM, Mohiuddin Anwar <mohiuddin@netzero.net> wrote:
Very good comment from Ms.Farida Mazid. I support her views not views of Sitanshu's. Sitangshi is pro-Indian and always tries to protect the interest
of his second home India and forgets the interest of his motherland Bangladesh. He never condemned the killing of Banladeshis by Hayena BSF'[s.


---------- Original Message ----------
From: Farida Majid <farida_majid@hotmail.com>
To: "mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>, "khabor@yahoogroups.com" <khabor@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: RE: [mukto-mona] Re: Conflicting accounts towards NY terrorist
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2012 19:45:22 -0400

 

          Sitangshu,
                           You're a good activist, but a very lazy analyzer.  This not a time for easy arithmetics. You say you're against 'fundamentalists' but you really end up endorsing their ideas in a covert way.
            Remember 2004 Presidential election time?  There was a Osama bin Laden video that suddenly made an appearance and scared the voters against Islamic terrorists. And Bush won narrowly.  This time there is a scare tactics of Tea Parties to label Obama as a "Muslim" which would turn away millions of Christian fundamentalist voters.

            Keep in mind: A Republican win would favor Jamaati fundamentalist of Bangladesh-- they (U. S. foreign policy in general) dislike "secularism" since they equate that with communists. The State Dept. is already very cosy with Jamaati leaders.

         There were a lot of unknown factors involved in the Ramu destruction and LOT of money came pouring in for the extraordinary operation.  Your peyara Awami League people were completely ineffectual and they have a lot of answering to do.  Read this disgusting fellow's article below -- he is a bitter and extreme fundo -- but his writing has some points that need to be answered.

           Assalamu alaikum.

Please find my new article "বৌদ্ধদের উপর হামলা এবং দেশধ্বংসী সংকটে বাংলাদেশ (Attack on the Budhists and the Critical Crisis in Bangladesh)" as attached word and pdf file.

You can also find the same article by clicking the following link:
http://www.drfirozmahboobkamal.com/2010-03-24-10-21-22/877-attack-on-the-budhists-in-bangladesh-and-the-critical-crisis.html

It is also pasted below for your convenience.

If you find any merit in the article, please send it to others.
Regards.

Firoz Mahboob Kamal


 

To: bangladesh-progressives@googlegroups.com; khabor@yahoogroups.com
CC: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
From: guhasb@gmail.com
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2012 17:05:56 -0400
Subject: [mukto-mona] Re: Conflicting accounts towards NY terrorist

 

Here we go again!!!!!!
This is the people, who spreads the rumour that, Jews are behind 9/11-------
This is the people who spreads, India is behind Ramu's incident!!!!!!!!!
and wash their hands!
So, fundamentalism and terrorism will continue growing. Doing so, these people actually help the terrorists, they are the sympathesiers!
While they should think why a 21 year old become a terrorist, find the reason to rectify it; they are trying to find a hole to blame others and wash their hands!


 
On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 9:11 AM, Shah Deeldar <shahdeeldar@yahoo.com> wrote:
Is Nafis really framed? Or, he was rather a willing soul to be a good victim? The kid did not believe in violence for the Muslim cause and yet, he resorted to commit the act. So, how can a westerner or easterner can trust these kinds of people who say certain things in public but would not hesitate to do the opposite? Is Islam a peaceful religion? Doesn't it sound like a broken record? How long can we keep the violent doctrine of Islam under the rug? If Nafis has committed his act in Bangladesh, he would have been showered by rose petals by a great number of people as we can see recent responses to violence against the Buddhists and minorities. Who are brainwashing these Nafises? Parents, Imams, local thugs? What should the buck stop?
-SD
 
 
 

Conflicting accounts towards NY terrorist
 
NEW YORK: At the Missouri college where Quazi Mohammad Rezwanul Ahsan Nafis enrolled, a classmate said he often remarked that true Muslims don't believe in violence.    
That image seemed startlingly at odds with the Bangladesh native's arrest in an FBI sting this week on charges of trying to blow up the Federal Reserve Bank in New York with what he thought was a 1,000-pound car bomb.
"I can't imagine being more shocked about somebody doing something like this," said Jim Dow, a 54-year-old Army veteran who rode home from class with Nafis twice a week. "I didn't just meet this kid a couple of times. We talked quite a bit. … And this doesn't seem to be in character."
Nafis' family in Dhaka, Bangladesh, denied he could have been involved in the plot. His parents said he was incapable of such actions and came to America only to study.
Federal investigators, often accused by defense attorneys of entrapping and leading would-be terrorists along, said the 21-year-old Nafis made the first move over the summer, reaching out for accomplices and eventually contacting a government informant, who then went to federal authorities.
They said he also selected his target, drove the van loaded with dummy explosives up to the door of the bank, and tried to set off the bomb from a hotel room using a cellphone he thought had been rigged as a detonator.
During the investigation, he and the informant corresponded via Facebook and other social media, talked on the phone and met in hotel rooms, according to a law enforcement official who was not authorized to speak publicly and spoke on condition of anonymity.    Nafis spoke of his admiration for Osama bin Laden, talked of writing an article about his plot for an AL-Qaida-affiliated magazine, and said he would be willing to be a martyr but preferred to go home to his family after carrying out the attack, authorities said. And he also talked about wanting to kill President Barack Obama and bomb the New York Stock Exchange, a law enforcement official said.
Investigators said in court papers that he came to the U.S. bent on jihad and worked out the specifics of a plot when he arrived. While Nafis believed he had the blessing of al-Qaida and was acting on behalf of the terrorist group, he has no known ties, according to federal officials.
Nafis, who at the time of his arrest Wednesday was working as a busboy at a restaurant in Manhattan, was jailed without bail. His attorney has not commented on the case, but in other instances where undercover agents and sting operations were used, lawyers have argued entrapment.
Investigators would not say exactly how he initially contacted the government informant.
Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly, whose department had a role in the arrest as a member of a joint federal-state terrorism task force, said the entrapment argument rarely prevails.
"You have to be otherwise not disposed to do a crime," Kelly said. "And if it's your intent to do a crime, and somehow there are means made available, then generally speaking, the entrapment defense does not succeed."
Nafis was a terrible student in his native Bangladesh, and his middle-class parents said he persuaded them to send him to study in the US as a way of improving his job prospects. They don't believe he was planning an attack.
His father, a banker, said Nafis was so timid he couldn't venture out onto the roof alone.
"My son couldn't have done it," Quazi Ahsanullah said, weeping.
"He is very gentle and devoted to his studies," he said, pointing to Nafis' time studying at the private North South University in Dhaka.    Belal Ahmed, a spokesman for the university, said Nafis was put on probation and threatened with expulsion if he didn't bring his grades up. Nafis eventually stopped coming to school, Ahmed said.
The father of Bangladeshi national Quazi Mohammad Rezwanul Ahsan Nafis who arrested in New York for attempting to detonate a bomb, cries alongside other relatives in Dhaka.—AFP photo
Ahsanullah said his son had argued that a US degree would give him a better chance at success in Bangladesh. "I spent all my savings to send him to America," the father said.
Nafis moved to Missouri, where he studied cyber security at Southeast Missouri State University. He also became vice president of the school's Muslim Student Association and began attending a mosque.
But he withdrew after one semester and requested over the summer that his records be transferred to a school in Brooklyn. The university declined to identify which school.    Dow, his former classmate at Southeast Missouri State, said Nafis spoke admiringly of bin Laden.
At the same time, "he told me he didn't really believe bin Laden was involved in the twin towers because he said bin Laden was a religious man, and a religious man wouldn't have done something like that," Dow said.
He said Nafis gave Dow a copy of the Quran and asked him to read it. But he "didn't rant or rave or say crazy stuff," Dow said.
"What really shocked me the most was he had specifically spoken to me about true Muslims not believing in violence," Dow said.
Dion Duncan of St. Louis, a fellow student and member of the Muslim organization, said: "Nafis was a good kid. He showed no traces of anti-Americanism, or death to America, or anything like that. He was a trustworthy, honest kid."
"He was polite and courteous. He was helpful. All the things you would expect from a good Muslim kid. He prayed five times a day," Duncan said.
 
 
"All great truths begin as blasphemies." GBS

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"All great truths begin as blasphemies." GBS


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"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it".
               -Beatrice Hall [pseudonym: S.G. Tallentyre], 190




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[mukto-mona] Fw: Paper clippings relating to Minority Repression in Bangladesh : from BDMW [9 Attachments]

[Attachment(s) from Jiten Roy included below]



--- On Thu, 10/18/12, Rabindra Ghosh <info@bdmw.org> wrote:

From: Rabindra Ghosh <info@bdmw.org>
Subject: Paper clippings relating to Minority Repression in Bangladesh : from BDMW
To: bangladeshminoritywatch@gmail.com
Date: Thursday, October 18, 2012, 3:48 PM



Hi all, 


Please be kind to read the Bangla news items published in the national dailies of Bangladesh on the repression against Minorities. Please also be kind to translate those items into English or any other languages you need to focus for awareness amongst the people of the country.

Your kind intervention in this regard will be highly appreciated.

Bangladesh Minority Watch (BDMW) has already investigated incidents of attack on Temples of Buddhists at Ramu, Teknaf, Ukhiya and Potiya at the ground zero level and is going to publish it for wide circulation.

With best regards,

Rabindra Ghosh
Founder President-Bangladesh Minority Watch (BDMW)
12, K.M. Das Lane, Tikatully,, Bholagiri Trust, Sutrapur P.S.,Dhaka, Banglaldesh.
www.bdmw.org


Attachment(s) from Jiten Roy

9 of 9 Photo(s)


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Re: [mukto-mona] Re: Conflicting accounts towards NY terrorist




Needless to say that fundo, Kamal is a typical jamati, who loves to enjoy the English hospitality but hates infidels from his guts.The man is a low class spin-master and sees no evil from the side of Islamists. His only problems are Hindus, Jews, Christians and Awamis who had prevented his Muslim Ummah dream. If only Muslims had stuck together, the global Ummah would have been a reality by now? If we could only put up with a Muslim Khalifa for another thousand years, Allah would have permanently settled down right in desert of Mecca? The guy probably thinks if we could start praying few more times per day, our needs will be totally delivered from the heaven?

Look, there are plenty of bad apples among the Awamis but that is our reality. They did not protect the minorities at all. Yes, guilty as charged!      

 -SD
"All great truths begin as blasphemies." GBS

From: Farida Majid <farida_majid@hotmail.com>
To: "mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>; "khabor@yahoogroups.com" <khabor@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 19, 2012 7:45 PM
Subject: RE: [mukto-mona] Re: Conflicting accounts towards NY terrorist

 
          Sitangshu,
                           You're a good activist, but a very lazy analyzer.  This not a time for easy arithmetics. You say you're against 'fundamentalists' but you really end up endorsing their ideas in a covert way.
            Remember 2004 Presidential election time?  There was a Osama bin Laden video that suddenly made an appearance and scared the voters against Islamic terrorists. And Bush won narrowly.  This time there is a scare tactics of Tea Parties to label Obama as a "Muslim" which would turn away millions of Christian fundamentalist voters.

            Keep in mind: A Republican win would favor Jamaati fundamentalist of Bangladesh-- they (U. S. foreign policy in general) dislike "secularism" since they equate that with communists. The State Dept. is already very cosy with Jamaati leaders.

         There were a lot of unknown factors involved in the Ramu destruction and LOT of money came pouring in for the extraordinary operation.  Your peyara Awami League people were completely ineffectual and they have a lot of answering to do.  Read this disgusting fellow's article below -- he is a bitter and extreme fundo -- but his writing has some points that need to be answered.

           Assalamu alaikum.

Please find my new article "বৌদ্ধদের উপর হামলা এবং দেশধ্বংসী সংকটে বাংলাদেশ (Attack on the Budhists and the Critical Crisis in Bangladesh)" as attached word and pdf file.

You can also find the same article by clicking the following link:
http://www.drfirozmahboobkamal.com/2010-03-24-10-21-22/877-attack-on-the-budhists-in-bangladesh-and-the-critical-crisis.html

It is also pasted below for your convenience.

If you find any merit in the article, please send it to others.
Regards.

Firoz Mahboob Kamal



To: bangladesh-progressives@googlegroups.com; khabor@yahoogroups.com
CC: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
From: guhasb@gmail.com
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2012 17:05:56 -0400
Subject: [mukto-mona] Re: Conflicting accounts towards NY terrorist

 

Here we go again!!!!!!
This is the people, who spreads the rumour that, Jews are behind 9/11-------
This is the people who spreads, India is behind Ramu's incident!!!!!!!!!
and wash their hands!
So, fundamentalism and terrorism will continue growing. Doing so, these people actually help the terrorists, they are the sympathesiers!
While they should think why a 21 year old become a terrorist, find the reason to rectify it; they are trying to find a hole to blame others and wash their hands!


 
On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 9:11 AM, Shah Deeldar <shahdeeldar@yahoo.com> wrote:
Is Nafis really framed? Or, he was rather a willing soul to be a good victim? The kid did not believe in violence for the Muslim cause and yet, he resorted to commit the act. So, how can a westerner or easterner can trust these kinds of people who say certain things in public but would not hesitate to do the opposite? Is Islam a peaceful religion? Doesn't it sound like a broken record? How long can we keep the violent doctrine of Islam under the rug? If Nafis has committed his act in Bangladesh, he would have been showered by rose petals by a great number of people as we can see recent responses to violence against the Buddhists and minorities. Who are brainwashing these Nafises? Parents, Imams, local thugs? What should the buck stop?
-SD




Conflicting accounts towards NY terrorist

NEW YORK: At the Missouri college where Quazi Mohammad Rezwanul Ahsan Nafis enrolled, a classmate said he often remarked that true Muslims don't believe in violence.    
That image seemed startlingly at odds with the Bangladesh native's arrest in an FBI sting this week on charges of trying to blow up the Federal Reserve Bank in New York with what he thought was a 1,000-pound car bomb.
"I can't imagine being more shocked about somebody doing something like this," said Jim Dow, a 54-year-old Army veteran who rode home from class with Nafis twice a week. "I didn't just meet this kid a couple of times. We talked quite a bit. … And this doesn't seem to be in character."
Nafis' family in Dhaka, Bangladesh, denied he could have been involved in the plot. His parents said he was incapable of such actions and came to America only to study.
Federal investigators, often accused by defense attorneys of entrapping and leading would-be terrorists along, said the 21-year-old Nafis made the first move over the summer, reaching out for accomplices and eventually contacting a government informant, who then went to federal authorities.
They said he also selected his target, drove the van loaded with dummy explosives up to the door of the bank, and tried to set off the bomb from a hotel room using a cellphone he thought had been rigged as a detonator.
During the investigation, he and the informant corresponded via Facebook and other social media, talked on the phone and met in hotel rooms, according to a law enforcement official who was not authorized to speak publicly and spoke on condition of anonymity.    Nafis spoke of his admiration for Osama bin Laden, talked of writing an article about his plot for an AL-Qaida-affiliated magazine, and said he would be willing to be a martyr but preferred to go home to his family after carrying out the attack, authorities said. And he also talked about wanting to kill President Barack Obama and bomb the New York Stock Exchange, a law enforcement official said.
Investigators said in court papers that he came to the U.S. bent on jihad and worked out the specifics of a plot when he arrived. While Nafis believed he had the blessing of al-Qaida and was acting on behalf of the terrorist group, he has no known ties, according to federal officials.
Nafis, who at the time of his arrest Wednesday was working as a busboy at a restaurant in Manhattan, was jailed without bail. His attorney has not commented on the case, but in other instances where undercover agents and sting operations were used, lawyers have argued entrapment.
Investigators would not say exactly how he initially contacted the government informant.
Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly, whose department had a role in the arrest as a member of a joint federal-state terrorism task force, said the entrapment argument rarely prevails.
"You have to be otherwise not disposed to do a crime," Kelly said. "And if it's your intent to do a crime, and somehow there are means made available, then generally speaking, the entrapment defense does not succeed."
Nafis was a terrible student in his native Bangladesh, and his middle-class parents said he persuaded them to send him to study in the US as a way of improving his job prospects. They don't believe he was planning an attack.
His father, a banker, said Nafis was so timid he couldn't venture out onto the roof alone.
"My son couldn't have done it," Quazi Ahsanullah said, weeping.
"He is very gentle and devoted to his studies," he said, pointing to Nafis' time studying at the private North South University in Dhaka.    Belal Ahmed, a spokesman for the university, said Nafis was put on probation and threatened with expulsion if he didn't bring his grades up. Nafis eventually stopped coming to school, Ahmed said.
The father of Bangladeshi national Quazi Mohammad Rezwanul Ahsan Nafis who arrested in New York for attempting to detonate a bomb, cries alongside other relatives in Dhaka.—AFP photo
Ahsanullah said his son had argued that a US degree would give him a better chance at success in Bangladesh. "I spent all my savings to send him to America," the father said.
Nafis moved to Missouri, where he studied cyber security at Southeast Missouri State University. He also became vice president of the school's Muslim Student Association and began attending a mosque.
But he withdrew after one semester and requested over the summer that his records be transferred to a school in Brooklyn. The university declined to identify which school.    Dow, his former classmate at Southeast Missouri State, said Nafis spoke admiringly of bin Laden.
At the same time, "he told me he didn't really believe bin Laden was involved in the twin towers because he said bin Laden was a religious man, and a religious man wouldn't have done something like that," Dow said.
He said Nafis gave Dow a copy of the Quran and asked him to read it. But he "didn't rant or rave or say crazy stuff," Dow said.
"What really shocked me the most was he had specifically spoken to me about true Muslims not believing in violence," Dow said.
Dion Duncan of St. Louis, a fellow student and member of the Muslim organization, said: "Nafis was a good kid. He showed no traces of anti-Americanism, or death to America, or anything like that. He was a trustworthy, honest kid."
"He was polite and courteous. He was helpful. All the things you would expect from a good Muslim kid. He prayed five times a day," Duncan said.

 
"All great truths begin as blasphemies." GBS

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Re: [mukto-mona] Re: Conflicting accounts towards NY terrorist



Hello Mohiuddin: I never expect your support and if you support me sometime, then I must think, I am not in the right path!
 
Can you tell me one thing: When Buddhists were beating Muslims in Burma, you had proposed that all Buddhists need to be sent to Burma from BD. Now you are shedding crocodiles tears for Buddhists and Hindus! For what?
 
I am glad that I am not pro-Pakistan or Iran or BNP, Jamat and I am pro-democracy. India is the largest democracy. Just think this point: will you send your under 18 son (Imaginary) to Pakistan, Iran, BD alone to stay there; but you will send him to London, USA or India; this is not because they are non-Muslims; rather they are democratic and give some respect to all. Look, all those Muslim countries could not produce an Oscar winner AR Rahman; India does, because in democracy you have the ability to grow, not in any religion based country! That is why we will always want BD a democratic country, not a mini Pakistan.
Thank you.

On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 8:16 PM, Mohiuddin Anwar <mohiuddin@netzero.net> wrote:
Very good comment from Ms.Farida Mazid. I support her views not views of Sitanshu's. Sitangshi is pro-Indian and always tries to protect the interest
of his second home India and forgets the interest of his motherland Bangladesh. He never condemned the killing of Banladeshis by Hayena BSF'[s.


---------- Original Message ----------
From: Farida Majid <farida_majid@hotmail.com>
To: "mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>, "khabor@yahoogroups.com" <khabor@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: RE: [mukto-mona] Re: Conflicting accounts towards NY terrorist
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2012 19:45:22 -0400

 

          Sitangshu,
                           You're a good activist, but a very lazy analyzer.  This not a time for easy arithmetics. You say you're against 'fundamentalists' but you really end up endorsing their ideas in a covert way.
            Remember 2004 Presidential election time?  There was a Osama bin Laden video that suddenly made an appearance and scared the voters against Islamic terrorists. And Bush won narrowly.  This time there is a scare tactics of Tea Parties to label Obama as a "Muslim" which would turn away millions of Christian fundamentalist voters.

            Keep in mind: A Republican win would favor Jamaati fundamentalist of Bangladesh-- they (U. S. foreign policy in general) dislike "secularism" since they equate that with communists. The State Dept. is already very cosy with Jamaati leaders.

         There were a lot of unknown factors involved in the Ramu destruction and LOT of money came pouring in for the extraordinary operation.  Your peyara Awami League people were completely ineffectual and they have a lot of answering to do.  Read this disgusting fellow's article below -- he is a bitter and extreme fundo -- but his writing has some points that need to be answered.

           Assalamu alaikum.

Please find my new article "বৌদ্ধদের উপর হামলা এবং দেশধ্বংসী সংকটে বাংলাদেশ (Attack on the Budhists and the Critical Crisis in Bangladesh)" as attached word and pdf file.

You can also find the same article by clicking the following link:
http://www.drfirozmahboobkamal.com/2010-03-24-10-21-22/877-attack-on-the-budhists-in-bangladesh-and-the-critical-crisis.html

It is also pasted below for your convenience.

If you find any merit in the article, please send it to others.
Regards.

Firoz Mahboob Kamal


 

To: bangladesh-progressives@googlegroups.com; khabor@yahoogroups.com
CC: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
From: guhasb@gmail.com
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2012 17:05:56 -0400
Subject: [mukto-mona] Re: Conflicting accounts towards NY terrorist

 

Here we go again!!!!!!
This is the people, who spreads the rumour that, Jews are behind 9/11-------
This is the people who spreads, India is behind Ramu's incident!!!!!!!!!
and wash their hands!
So, fundamentalism and terrorism will continue growing. Doing so, these people actually help the terrorists, they are the sympathesiers!
While they should think why a 21 year old become a terrorist, find the reason to rectify it; they are trying to find a hole to blame others and wash their hands!


 
On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 9:11 AM, Shah Deeldar <shahdeeldar@yahoo.com> wrote:
Is Nafis really framed? Or, he was rather a willing soul to be a good victim? The kid did not believe in violence for the Muslim cause and yet, he resorted to commit the act. So, how can a westerner or easterner can trust these kinds of people who say certain things in public but would not hesitate to do the opposite? Is Islam a peaceful religion? Doesn't it sound like a broken record? How long can we keep the violent doctrine of Islam under the rug? If Nafis has committed his act in Bangladesh, he would have been showered by rose petals by a great number of people as we can see recent responses to violence against the Buddhists and minorities. Who are brainwashing these Nafises? Parents, Imams, local thugs? What should the buck stop?
-SD
 
 
 

Conflicting accounts towards NY terrorist
 
NEW YORK: At the Missouri college where Quazi Mohammad Rezwanul Ahsan Nafis enrolled, a classmate said he often remarked that true Muslims don't believe in violence.    
That image seemed startlingly at odds with the Bangladesh native's arrest in an FBI sting this week on charges of trying to blow up the Federal Reserve Bank in New York with what he thought was a 1,000-pound car bomb.
"I can't imagine being more shocked about somebody doing something like this," said Jim Dow, a 54-year-old Army veteran who rode home from class with Nafis twice a week. "I didn't just meet this kid a couple of times. We talked quite a bit. … And this doesn't seem to be in character."
Nafis' family in Dhaka, Bangladesh, denied he could have been involved in the plot. His parents said he was incapable of such actions and came to America only to study.
Federal investigators, often accused by defense attorneys of entrapping and leading would-be terrorists along, said the 21-year-old Nafis made the first move over the summer, reaching out for accomplices and eventually contacting a government informant, who then went to federal authorities.
They said he also selected his target, drove the van loaded with dummy explosives up to the door of the bank, and tried to set off the bomb from a hotel room using a cellphone he thought had been rigged as a detonator.
During the investigation, he and the informant corresponded via Facebook and other social media, talked on the phone and met in hotel rooms, according to a law enforcement official who was not authorized to speak publicly and spoke on condition of anonymity.    Nafis spoke of his admiration for Osama bin Laden, talked of writing an article about his plot for an AL-Qaida-affiliated magazine, and said he would be willing to be a martyr but preferred to go home to his family after carrying out the attack, authorities said. And he also talked about wanting to kill President Barack Obama and bomb the New York Stock Exchange, a law enforcement official said.
Investigators said in court papers that he came to the U.S. bent on jihad and worked out the specifics of a plot when he arrived. While Nafis believed he had the blessing of al-Qaida and was acting on behalf of the terrorist group, he has no known ties, according to federal officials.
Nafis, who at the time of his arrest Wednesday was working as a busboy at a restaurant in Manhattan, was jailed without bail. His attorney has not commented on the case, but in other instances where undercover agents and sting operations were used, lawyers have argued entrapment.
Investigators would not say exactly how he initially contacted the government informant.
Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly, whose department had a role in the arrest as a member of a joint federal-state terrorism task force, said the entrapment argument rarely prevails.
"You have to be otherwise not disposed to do a crime," Kelly said. "And if it's your intent to do a crime, and somehow there are means made available, then generally speaking, the entrapment defense does not succeed."
Nafis was a terrible student in his native Bangladesh, and his middle-class parents said he persuaded them to send him to study in the US as a way of improving his job prospects. They don't believe he was planning an attack.
His father, a banker, said Nafis was so timid he couldn't venture out onto the roof alone.
"My son couldn't have done it," Quazi Ahsanullah said, weeping.
"He is very gentle and devoted to his studies," he said, pointing to Nafis' time studying at the private North South University in Dhaka.    Belal Ahmed, a spokesman for the university, said Nafis was put on probation and threatened with expulsion if he didn't bring his grades up. Nafis eventually stopped coming to school, Ahmed said.
The father of Bangladeshi national Quazi Mohammad Rezwanul Ahsan Nafis who arrested in New York for attempting to detonate a bomb, cries alongside other relatives in Dhaka.—AFP photo
Ahsanullah said his son had argued that a US degree would give him a better chance at success in Bangladesh. "I spent all my savings to send him to America," the father said.
Nafis moved to Missouri, where he studied cyber security at Southeast Missouri State University. He also became vice president of the school's Muslim Student Association and began attending a mosque.
But he withdrew after one semester and requested over the summer that his records be transferred to a school in Brooklyn. The university declined to identify which school.    Dow, his former classmate at Southeast Missouri State, said Nafis spoke admiringly of bin Laden.
At the same time, "he told me he didn't really believe bin Laden was involved in the twin towers because he said bin Laden was a religious man, and a religious man wouldn't have done something like that," Dow said.
He said Nafis gave Dow a copy of the Quran and asked him to read it. But he "didn't rant or rave or say crazy stuff," Dow said.
"What really shocked me the most was he had specifically spoken to me about true Muslims not believing in violence," Dow said.
Dion Duncan of St. Louis, a fellow student and member of the Muslim organization, said: "Nafis was a good kid. He showed no traces of anti-Americanism, or death to America, or anything like that. He was a trustworthy, honest kid."
"He was polite and courteous. He was helpful. All the things you would expect from a good Muslim kid. He prayed five times a day," Duncan said.
 
 
"All great truths begin as blasphemies." GBS

--
Disclaimer: All content provided on this discussion forum is for informational purposes only. The owner of this forum makes no representations as to the accuracy or completeness of any information on this site or found by following any link on this site. The owner will not be liable for any errors or omissions in this information nor for the availability of this information. The owner will not be liable for any losses, injuries, or damages from the display or use of this information.
This policy is subject to change at anytime.


 

 

 

 



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****************************************************

"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it".
               -Beatrice Hall [pseudonym: S.G. Tallentyre], 190




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Re: [mukto-mona] Re: Conflicting accounts towards NY terrorist



Hello Farida APA; Glad to hear from you after long time. Surely, I see your postings as always. I was really laughing reading your first sentence and I liked it, it does not matter if you are right or wrong. What I liked is that, it has an underlying tone of an elder sister!  Thank you Farida APA; we have a lot of differences, but we believe unity in diversity.  I know that you are in BD now and I felt jealous that you have the opportunity to live your homeland.

But, I can't agree with your points. You know that I had written 3 presidential elections in 3 long years in weekly Thikana and all three times my prediction was right.  I am not 100% sure, but my prediction is that, when Ramni had chosen Ryan as VP, Obama lost the election. For me, I am not a democrat, nor a republican; whoever wins I am with America.  And do you want to say that, even Ramu's hatred is for the cause of US election?

In a previous mail I had written this morning that, Durga Puja is from today, one Honorable Congressman was supposed to visit one Puja, but after this incident he had cancelled that! Later his office was convinced that, although Bangladeshi, these people are different and are never involved with this type of violence. He will come. So, try to understand where we stand! And why?

Another fact: I tried to convince our high officials here that, they should visit some Puja Pandels in the context of Ramu incident, accordingly they were invited. Do they care? Answer is 'No'.

 

We always blame Jamaat and wash our hands! What Ramu tells you? Who was not involved there? Is that not terrorism? Nandirhat, Satkhira, 2001, 1992--are those not terrorism? Problem is much acute than that.



On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 7:45 PM, Farida Majid <farida_majid@hotmail.com> wrote:
          Sitangshu,
                           You're a good activist, but a very lazy analyzer.  This not a time for easy arithmetics. You say you're against 'fundamentalists' but you really end up endorsing their ideas in a covert way.
            Remember 2004 Presidential election time?  There was a Osama bin Laden video that suddenly made an appearance and scared the voters against Islamic terrorists. And Bush won narrowly.  This time there is a scare tactics of Tea Parties to label Obama as a "Muslim" which would turn away millions of Christian fundamentalist voters.

            Keep in mind: A Republican win would favor Jamaati fundamentalist of Bangladesh-- they (U. S. foreign policy in general) dislike "secularism" since they equate that with communists. The State Dept. is already very cosy with Jamaati leaders.

         There were a lot of unknown factors involved in the Ramu destruction and LOT of money came pouring in for the extraordinary operation.  Your peyara Awami League people were completely ineffectual and they have a lot of answering to do.  Read this disgusting fellow's article below -- he is a bitter and extreme fundo -- but his writing has some points that need to be answered.

           Assalamu alaikum.

Please find my new article "বৌদ্ধদের উপর হামলা এবং দেশধ্বংসী সংকটে বাংলাদেশ (Attack on the Budhists and the Critical Crisis in Bangladesh)" as attached word and pdf file.

You can also find the same article by clicking the following link:
http://www.drfirozmahboobkamal.com/2010-03-24-10-21-22/877-attack-on-the-budhists-in-bangladesh-and-the-critical-crisis.html

It is also pasted below for your convenience.

If you find any merit in the article, please send it to others.
Regards.

Firoz Mahboob Kamal



To: bangladesh-progressives@googlegroups.com; khabor@yahoogroups.com
CC: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
From: guhasb@gmail.com
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2012 17:05:56 -0400
Subject: [mukto-mona] Re: Conflicting accounts towards NY terrorist

 

Here we go again!!!!!!
This is the people, who spreads the rumour that, Jews are behind 9/11-------
This is the people who spreads, India is behind Ramu's incident!!!!!!!!!
and wash their hands!
So, fundamentalism and terrorism will continue growing. Doing so, these people actually help the terrorists, they are the sympathesiers!
While they should think why a 21 year old become a terrorist, find the reason to rectify it; they are trying to find a hole to blame others and wash their hands!


 
On Fri, Oct 19, 2012 at 9:11 AM, Shah Deeldar <shahdeeldar@yahoo.com> wrote:
Is Nafis really framed? Or, he was rather a willing soul to be a good victim? The kid did not believe in violence for the Muslim cause and yet, he resorted to commit the act. So, how can a westerner or easterner can trust these kinds of people who say certain things in public but would not hesitate to do the opposite? Is Islam a peaceful religion? Doesn't it sound like a broken record? How long can we keep the violent doctrine of Islam under the rug? If Nafis has committed his act in Bangladesh, he would have been showered by rose petals by a great number of people as we can see recent responses to violence against the Buddhists and minorities. Who are brainwashing these Nafises? Parents, Imams, local thugs? What should the buck stop?
-SD




Conflicting accounts towards NY terrorist

NEW YORK: At the Missouri college where Quazi Mohammad Rezwanul Ahsan Nafis enrolled, a classmate said he often remarked that true Muslims don't believe in violence.    
That image seemed startlingly at odds with the Bangladesh native's arrest in an FBI sting this week on charges of trying to blow up the Federal Reserve Bank in New York with what he thought was a 1,000-pound car bomb.
"I can't imagine being more shocked about somebody doing something like this," said Jim Dow, a 54-year-old Army veteran who rode home from class with Nafis twice a week. "I didn't just meet this kid a couple of times. We talked quite a bit. … And this doesn't seem to be in character."
Nafis' family in Dhaka, Bangladesh, denied he could have been involved in the plot. His parents said he was incapable of such actions and came to America only to study.
Federal investigators, often accused by defense attorneys of entrapping and leading would-be terrorists along, said the 21-year-old Nafis made the first move over the summer, reaching out for accomplices and eventually contacting a government informant, who then went to federal authorities.
They said he also selected his target, drove the van loaded with dummy explosives up to the door of the bank, and tried to set off the bomb from a hotel room using a cellphone he thought had been rigged as a detonator.
During the investigation, he and the informant corresponded via Facebook and other social media, talked on the phone and met in hotel rooms, according to a law enforcement official who was not authorized to speak publicly and spoke on condition of anonymity.    Nafis spoke of his admiration for Osama bin Laden, talked of writing an article about his plot for an AL-Qaida-affiliated magazine, and said he would be willing to be a martyr but preferred to go home to his family after carrying out the attack, authorities said. And he also talked about wanting to kill President Barack Obama and bomb the New York Stock Exchange, a law enforcement official said.
Investigators said in court papers that he came to the U.S. bent on jihad and worked out the specifics of a plot when he arrived. While Nafis believed he had the blessing of al-Qaida and was acting on behalf of the terrorist group, he has no known ties, according to federal officials.
Nafis, who at the time of his arrest Wednesday was working as a busboy at a restaurant in Manhattan, was jailed without bail. His attorney has not commented on the case, but in other instances where undercover agents and sting operations were used, lawyers have argued entrapment.
Investigators would not say exactly how he initially contacted the government informant.
Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly, whose department had a role in the arrest as a member of a joint federal-state terrorism task force, said the entrapment argument rarely prevails.
"You have to be otherwise not disposed to do a crime," Kelly said. "And if it's your intent to do a crime, and somehow there are means made available, then generally speaking, the entrapment defense does not succeed."
Nafis was a terrible student in his native Bangladesh, and his middle-class parents said he persuaded them to send him to study in the US as a way of improving his job prospects. They don't believe he was planning an attack.
His father, a banker, said Nafis was so timid he couldn't venture out onto the roof alone.
"My son couldn't have done it," Quazi Ahsanullah said, weeping.
"He is very gentle and devoted to his studies," he said, pointing to Nafis' time studying at the private North South University in Dhaka.    Belal Ahmed, a spokesman for the university, said Nafis was put on probation and threatened with expulsion if he didn't bring his grades up. Nafis eventually stopped coming to school, Ahmed said.
The father of Bangladeshi national Quazi Mohammad Rezwanul Ahsan Nafis who arrested in New York for attempting to detonate a bomb, cries alongside other relatives in Dhaka.—AFP photo
Ahsanullah said his son had argued that a US degree would give him a better chance at success in Bangladesh. "I spent all my savings to send him to America," the father said.
Nafis moved to Missouri, where he studied cyber security at Southeast Missouri State University. He also became vice president of the school's Muslim Student Association and began attending a mosque.
But he withdrew after one semester and requested over the summer that his records be transferred to a school in Brooklyn. The university declined to identify which school.    Dow, his former classmate at Southeast Missouri State, said Nafis spoke admiringly of bin Laden.
At the same time, "he told me he didn't really believe bin Laden was involved in the twin towers because he said bin Laden was a religious man, and a religious man wouldn't have done something like that," Dow said.
He said Nafis gave Dow a copy of the Quran and asked him to read it. But he "didn't rant or rave or say crazy stuff," Dow said.
"What really shocked me the most was he had specifically spoken to me about true Muslims not believing in violence," Dow said.
Dion Duncan of St. Louis, a fellow student and member of the Muslim organization, said: "Nafis was a good kid. He showed no traces of anti-Americanism, or death to America, or anything like that. He was a trustworthy, honest kid."
"He was polite and courteous. He was helpful. All the things you would expect from a good Muslim kid. He prayed five times a day," Duncan said.

 
"All great truths begin as blasphemies." GBS

--
Disclaimer: All content provided on this discussion forum is for informational purposes only. The owner of this forum makes no representations as to the accuracy or completeness of any information on this site or found by following any link on this site. The owner will not be liable for any errors or omissions in this information nor for the availability of this information. The owner will not be liable for any losses, injuries, or damages from the display or use of this information.
This policy is subject to change at anytime.





__._,_.___


****************************************************
Mukto Mona plans for a Grand Darwin Day Celebration: 
Call For Articles:

http://mukto-mona.com/wordpress/?p=68

http://mukto-mona.com/banga_blog/?p=585

****************************************************

VISIT MUKTO-MONA WEB-SITE : http://www.mukto-mona.com/

****************************************************

"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it".
               -Beatrice Hall [pseudonym: S.G. Tallentyre], 190




Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional
Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required)
Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured
Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe

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