Banner Advertiser

Tuesday, November 10, 2015

Re: [mukto-mona] Greater equanimity required in understanding tolerance - bdnews24.com opinion



The intolerance thing did not start yesterday. It is a global phenomenon and you can see mosques being firebombed in many civilized countries like Germany, Sweden, Denmark and many other European countries. Country Hungary does not want a single Muslim refugee in their towns? Where are they getting such repugnant ideas? Not sure whom should I call truly civilized? Muslims are not the only the victims of this menace. The political Islam is not a benign entity as you might think. It is equally guilty of creating the monster.... by not advocating people to integrate in any society wherever Muslims are settling down.  Ask any 'civil' European or 'uncivil' Indian and you will get your answer.  You must be thinking the whole world has gone bad and mad with only you being sane?

My point was not about Aqlaque or how many Hindu girls are being kidnapped and forcefully converted to religion of peace in Pakistan. Do you think Indians are so civilized that they can differentiate between these two incidents? The very similar incidents have already happened in the US too.

Relevancy is in the eyes of the beholder!










On Tuesday, November 10, 2015 5:48 PM, "Sukhamaya Bain subain1@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 
I think most of the questions by Mr. Deeldar here are either irrelevant or corrupted with statements that are wrong.

'Are Muslims totally innocent ....?' As far as the murder of Mr. Akhlaq and the atrocities against his family are concerned, the talk should be about the Hindu barbarians, not about Muslims.

'Are Muslims totally secular as Muslim think ....?' First, what community is totally secular? Second, do most Muslims really think that they are secular?

Does it justify any civilized country be be religious fanatic because Muslim-majority countries are? My answer is, NO. What the civilized countries need to do is to stay civilized, and push for the barbarians to get civilized.

'Eventually a cow would be slaughtered right in front of a Hindu house to test the Indian secularism.' Really, Mr. Deeldar? Is any civilized country in the world allowing slaughtering of any animal on city streets or in neighborhoods in front of any kind of people's home? The answer is, NO. Surely India's secularism test should not involve cow slaughtering in front of Hindu houses. In fact, Bangladesh needs to make the progress of slaughtering cows and other animals only in designated slaughterhouses and away from public views.

I believe I have addressed most of Dr. Roy's points as well.

Sukhamaya Bain

==============================



On Sunday, November 8, 2015 9:07 PM, "Shah Deeldar shahdeeldar@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 
The question is why the trouble has started in India now? Are Muslims totally innocents as Muslims say? Are Muslims totally secular as Muslims think or feel? I do see a problem there with duplicity in the light of what has been happening locally and globally. Most Muslim majority countries have no respect or regard for minority rights while Muslims want West and other infidel countries to be perfect in secularism and treat Muslims fairly? Even Muslims can't stand Muslims and Muslims fleeing from Muslim countries for better life in infidel countries. I am troubled with such dichotomy.
Eventually a cow would be slaughtered right in front of a Hindu house to test the Indian secularism. Why that should be a problem for the Hindus? The problem is not a black and white as people think.  
 






On Sunday, November 8, 2015 1:05 PM, "Jiten Roy jnrsr53@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 
"How would you muzzle their nonviolent act of feeling sad and outrage over the state of affairs vis-a-vis beef eating in India?"
Politicians will not go against a popular demand; it's a suicidal act for them.
It will be naïve to say that ban on cow-slaughter is just against banning beef-eating. It could be supported if it was done just for the right to eat beef alone, but the issue has religious sentiment to it also. Indian liberal intellectuals are lining up to return their awards over it is a publicity stunt.
Remember the proverb – "বসতে দিলে খেতে চায়; খেত দিলে শুতে ছায়, ইত্যাদি, ইত্যাদি,"
Let's say you legalize cow slaughter. What will happen when Muslims start slaughtering thousands of cows for the EID celebration, while Hindus, in the next door, start worshiping cows for Jonmastomi celebration?
It's not as simple as many liberals may make it to be.
Jiten Roy

 

From: "Sukhamaya Bain subain1@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, November 8, 2015 9:51 AM
Subject: [mukto-mona] Greater equanimity required in understanding tolerance - bdnews24.com opinion

 
My following comments on the subject article in bdnews24.com are 'awaiting moderation' since the morning of November 6, 2015 (Bangladesh Time):

"Another mumbo jumbo write-up. What a gibberish, "Writers, poets, artists and scientists are expressing their dissent like never before by returning their awards. But had there been intolerance their views and acts would have certainly been muzzled/ tried to be muzzled."! How would you not tolerate someone giving up his/her award, Mr. Kapoor? How would you muzzle their nonviolent act of feeling sad and outrage over the state of affairs vis-a-vis beef eating in India? Lynch them like what was done to Mohammad Akhlaq in Uttar Pradesh? The reality of the matter is that India, even under the secularism-flashing political parties, has been intolerant of beef eating. The reality is that in almost 90% of the land area of India, slaughtering cow and eating beef are prohibited by law. You can read more on the subject by clicking the link below.


India surely needs to improve a lot on not imposing illogical majority and mob wishes on its citizens."










__._,_.___

Posted by: Shah Deeldar <shahdeeldar@yahoo.com>


****************************************************
Mukto Mona plans for a Grand Darwin Day Celebration: 
Call For Articles:

http://mukto-mona.com/wordpress/?p=68

http://mukto-mona.com/banga_blog/?p=585

****************************************************

VISIT MUKTO-MONA WEB-SITE : http://www.mukto-mona.com/

****************************************************

"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it".
               -Beatrice Hall [pseudonym: S.G. Tallentyre], 190





__,_._,___

Re: [mukto-mona] Greater equanimity required in understanding tolerance - bdnews24.com opinion



Dr. Bain,
Your comments are based on the perspective of the Western countries, and Indian society and civilization is an ocean away from that. In fact, I am not sure Indian society will ever be able to reach that level, because of their unadulterated ancient barbaric ritualistic religious practices. Thousands of goats are being sacrificed in Hind-Temples every day in such a horrific barbaric way that - if you see once, you will never forget it.
Let me tell you my own experience of witnessing a barbaric goat sacrifice ritual in a Kali Temple, which I can't forget even today. First they tie the mouth of the goat with a rope so it won't be able to make loud noise. Then, one guy rotate the front two legs 180 degree so that he can hold onto them to lift and place the neck onto the wooden frame, where other guy is waiting to cut it, sometime with one strike; sometime with multiple strikes.
Even though, this is my childhood observation, and I can guarantee, nothing has changed in half a century. And, I am sure, cow slaughtering is not any more humane than this.
Now, tell me, which politician will dare to challenge these barbaric ritualistic practices?
The civilized nation mainly practices Christianity, which is the most refined religion on earth. These religious people will abide by  any sensible reform or restriction on their practices, which is not possible in any of the uncivilized countries, like India and Bangladesh. 
I hear, slaughter house here, has a  sedative fill room to knock animals out before being slaughtered. If India goes there one day, I will have no problem with slaughtering animals. Until then, I can't support any more animal cruelty. In fact, I will be happy if Indian government can ban the barbaric ritualistic practices in all those Hindu Temples.

 

From: "Sukhamaya Bain subain1@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, November 9, 2015 10:08 PM
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Greater equanimity required in understanding tolerance - bdnews24.com opinion

 
I think most of the questions by Mr. Deeldar here are either irrelevant or corrupted with statements that are wrong.

'Are Muslims totally innocent ....?' As far as the murder of Mr. Akhlaq and the atrocities against his family are concerned, the talk should be about the Hindu barbarians, not about Muslims.

'Are Muslims totally secular as Muslim think ....?' First, what community is totally secular? Second, do most Muslims really think that they are secular?

Does it justify any civilized country be be religious fanatic because Muslim-majority countries are? My answer is, NO. What the civilized countries need to do is to stay civilized, and push for the barbarians to get civilized.

'Eventually a cow would be slaughtered right in front of a Hindu house to test the Indian secularism.' Really, Mr. Deeldar? Is any civilized country in the world allowing slaughtering of any animal on city streets or in neighborhoods in front of any kind of people's home? The answer is, NO. Surely India's secularism test should not involve cow slaughtering in front of Hindu houses. In fact, Bangladesh needs to make the progress of slaughtering cows and other animals only in designated slaughterhouses and away from public views.

I believe I have addressed most of Dr. Roy's points as well.

Sukhamaya Bain

==============================

On Sunday, November 8, 2015 9:07 PM, "Shah Deeldar shahdeeldar@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 
The question is why the trouble has started in India now? Are Muslims totally innocents as Muslims say? Are Muslims totally secular as Muslims think or feel? I do see a problem there with duplicity in the light of what has been happening locally and globally. Most Muslim majority countries have no respect or regard for minority rights while Muslims want West and other infidel countries to be perfect in secularism and treat Muslims fairly? Even Muslims can't stand Muslims and Muslims fleeing from Muslim countries for better life in infidel countries. I am troubled with such dichotomy.
Eventually a cow would be slaughtered right in front of a Hindu house to test the Indian secularism. Why that should be a problem for the Hindus? The problem is not a black and white as people think.  
 






On Sunday, November 8, 2015 1:05 PM, "Jiten Roy jnrsr53@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 
"How would you muzzle their nonviolent act of feeling sad and outrage over the state of affairs vis-a-vis beef eating in India?"
Politicians will not go against a popular demand; it's a suicidal act for them.
It will be naïve to say that ban on cow-slaughter is just against banning beef-eating. It could be supported if it was done just for the right to eat beef alone, but the issue has religious sentiment to it also. Indian liberal intellectuals are lining up to return their awards over it is a publicity stunt.
Remember the proverb – "বসতে দিলে খেতে চায়; খেত দিলে শুতে ছায়, ইত্যাদি, ইত্যাদি,"
Let's say you legalize cow slaughter. What will happen when Muslims start slaughtering thousands of cows for the EID celebration, while Hindus, in the next door, start worshiping cows for Jonmastomi celebration?
It's not as simple as many liberals may make it to be.
Jiten Roy

 

From: "Sukhamaya Bain subain1@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, November 8, 2015 9:51 AM
Subject: [mukto-mona] Greater equanimity required in understanding tolerance - bdnews24.com opinion

 
My following comments on the subject article in bdnews24.com are 'awaiting moderation' since the morning of November 6, 2015 (Bangladesh Time):

"Another mumbo jumbo write-up. What a gibberish, "Writers, poets, artists and scientists are expressing their dissent like never before by returning their awards. But had there been intolerance their views and acts would have certainly been muzzled/ tried to be muzzled."! How would you not tolerate someone giving up his/her award, Mr. Kapoor? How would you muzzle their nonviolent act of feeling sad and outrage over the state of affairs vis-a-vis beef eating in India? Lynch them like what was done to Mohammad Akhlaq in Uttar Pradesh? The reality of the matter is that India, even under the secularism-flashing political parties, has been intolerant of beef eating. The reality is that in almost 90% of the land area of India, slaughtering cow and eating beef are prohibited by law. You can read more on the subject by clicking the link below.


India surely needs to improve a lot on not imposing illogical majority and mob wishes on its citizens."












__._,_.___

Posted by: Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com>


****************************************************
Mukto Mona plans for a Grand Darwin Day Celebration: 
Call For Articles:

http://mukto-mona.com/wordpress/?p=68

http://mukto-mona.com/banga_blog/?p=585

****************************************************

VISIT MUKTO-MONA WEB-SITE : http://www.mukto-mona.com/

****************************************************

"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it".
               -Beatrice Hall [pseudonym: S.G. Tallentyre], 190





__,_._,___

Re: [mukto-mona] Bangladesh sentences 6 to death in torture deaths of 2 boys



Sorry for my dyslexic mind.
Please read my post as-
"Apples vs oranges? Votes vs no votes? An unfortunate clever game is being played by the ruling party?"



On Monday, November 9, 2015 8:27 PM, "Shah Deeldar shahdeeldar@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 
Apples vs oranges? Votes vs no votes? An unfortunate clever is being played by the ruling party?



On Monday, November 9, 2015 6:40 PM, "Jiten Roy jnrsr53@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 
I am glad that this particular verdict came so quickly, but why others, such as the murderers of the of those so called bloggers, are taking such a long time even when culprits under the police custody?

 

From: "Jiten Roy jnrsr53@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
To: yahoogroups <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 8, 2015 9:13 AM
Subject: [mukto-mona] Bangladesh sentences 6 to death in torture deaths of 2 boys

 

   
Bangladesh sentences 6 to death in torture deaths of 2 boys
Associated Press
 
                                                         
    DHAKA, Bangladesh (AP) — Courts in Bangladesh sentenced six people to death Sunday for torturing and killing two young boys earlier this year.

    Samiul Islam Rajon, 13, died in July after he was brutally beaten. A 28-minute video of Rajon screaming for help as he was being beaten was posted online and went viral, shocking a nation long inured to violence against children.

    In the second incident, Rakib Hawlader, 12, died in August after his former employer at a car repair shop used a nozzle to pump air into his rectum and filled his body with air in retaliation for quitting his job.
    Judge Akbar Hossain Mridha found the main suspect in Rajon's death, Kamrul Islam, and three others guilty of fatally torturing the boy and sentenced all four to death. Four others involved in the beating death were sentenced to prison terms ranging from a year to life.

    In the video of Rajon's beating, recorded with a cellphone camera, the boy is heard screaming in pain and pleading with his attackers: "Don't beat me, please, I will die, I will die." The attackers laughed at the boy when he asked for water.

    Like many poor children in Bangladesh, Rajon was forced to leave school to work to help his family, in his case selling vegetables.

    The main suspect fled to Saudi Arabia but was detained there and deported last month through Interpol to face trial.

    Separately on Sunday, Judge Dilruba Sultana said that the owner of the car repair shop and an employee had tortured Hawlader, who later died in a hospital. Both were sentenced to death.
    • Crime & Justice
    • Society & Culture
    • DHAKA, Bangladesh
    Click to view comments
    View Comments (4)








    __._,_.___

    Posted by: Shah Deeldar <shahdeeldar@yahoo.com>


    ****************************************************
    Mukto Mona plans for a Grand Darwin Day Celebration: 
    Call For Articles:

    http://mukto-mona.com/wordpress/?p=68

    http://mukto-mona.com/banga_blog/?p=585

    ****************************************************

    VISIT MUKTO-MONA WEB-SITE : http://www.mukto-mona.com/

    ****************************************************

    "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it".
                   -Beatrice Hall [pseudonym: S.G. Tallentyre], 190





    __,_._,___