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Friday, November 30, 2012

[mukto-mona] Enclosed an article about “Ain Na Mana O Vogbadi Monoshikota 2012” [1 Attachment]

[Attachment(s) from Jahangir Hossain included below]

Dear Editor

 

Enclosed an article about "Ain Na Mana O Vogbadi Monoshikota 2012" for your kind perusal and publish your newspaper.

 

Thanking you and best regards.

 

Jahangir Hossain (Essayist)

12/F-4, Suvastu Nazar Valley, Tower # 5

Progati Sharani, Dhaka # 1212

Cell : 01716 260806

Email : jahangirhossaindhaka@gmail.com


Attachment(s) from Jahangir Hossain

1 of 1 File(s)


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Re: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat



"If evidences are credible against Jamat.... they should be punished". This "if" statement is really surprising. Does this mean that Mr. Rahman is not aware of the role of Jamat in 1971? Does he have any doubt that the Jamat leaders under trial may be innocent? Does he not know about the agenda of Jamat to discriminate against other religions and against other sects within Islam? Is he not aware of the fact that the original 1972 constitution does not allow registration if religion based political party? I read an article many decades ago (nearly 40 years) probably written by Amal Sen. The article said that Jamat is not like Muslim League. Jamat is an ideology. It has agenda that has goes beyond a limited time and space. It wears different masks at different times. Democracy is one such mask. But their ultimate goal is to establish a theological state. Bangladesh should restore the original 1972 constitution and cancel registration of Jamat. 
The articles  by Muntasir Mamun and also different pieces by Farida Majid should be our eye opener. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 30, 2012, at 10:42 AM, qar <qrahman@netscape.net> wrote:

 

His poor grasp of English (or any language) prevented him from getting the message that we do not want any lecture on "democracy" from the likes of him or S A Hannan (a gun-runner for Islamic terrorists in BD and an ardent supporter of Genocide 1971).

>>>>>>>>> You are read many hundreds of post I have written in discussion groups. I do NOT think I ever endorsed any political parties. ALL I have said that, EVERYONE should be dealt fairly and with the SAME rule.

If evidences are credible against Jammat or any other parties, they should be punished (Common sense!). Same rule should be applied to others as well.

I am not sure what prevents some of us to grasp this very simple logic?


The beauty of democracy is people have reasonably  fair chances to judge politicians based on their performances and judge them accordingly. This "Safe guard" will guard the safety of any community. >>  We do not want to tolerate such bs anymore.

>>>>>>>>>> Not sure if you are against democracy or not. There are plenty of Christian and Jewish political parties and the world is not falling apart because of them. As long they are NOT violent, what is wrong with them?

We have to separate violence/torture from politics. Divorcing religion from politics will only make them more popular to the mass (As seen in Turkey and Egypt).


I think you are misunderstanding the message of my previous posts.


Shalom!



-----Original Message-----
From: Farida Majid <farida_majid@hotmail.com>
To: mukto-mona <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thu, Nov 29, 2012 6:08 am
Subject: RE: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat

 
  Here we go again! Q.  Rahman flattering himself! How can I, or anybody, have any 'prejudice' against him?  He is not my neighbor, relative or kutumb, or a poet, artist, musician, teacher, social worker, political activist or writer -- people I closely or loosely associate with in my real life. I only know him on the internet.  Day after day, month after month, year after year, we are exposed his dishonesty, lack of any original thinking, and plain 'munafequi' when it comes to topics on religion.
           His poor grasp of English (or any language) prevented him from getting the message that we do not want any lecture on "democracy" from the likes of him or S A Hannan (a gun-runner for Islamic terrorists in BD and an ardent supporter of Genocide 1971).

         Earlier Q Rahman  spoke in ridiculous, and utterly meaningless tautology that left unexplained what he meant by 'religion'. << The beauty of democracy is people have reasonably  fair chances to judge politicians based on their performances and judge them accordingly. This "Safe guard" will guard the safety of any community. >>  We do not want to tolerate such bs anymore.

         Let us stop the EVIL of Jamaat and all other religious parties destroying our nation by spreading murder, arson, anarchy and mayhem.             

               STOP European style fascism in the guise of Jamaat-i-Islam!


To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
From: qrahman@netscape.net
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2012 21:01:53 -0500
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat

 

  Q. Rahman. the proseletyzer wants to lecture us about democracy

>>>>>>>>> When you start this way, I must be doing pretty bad job here. You are still with your prejudices intact. :-)



O K.  Tell me, in your lecturing tone, how does a political party based on a religion function in a democracy?



>>>>>>>>>> Pretty simple if we are sincere. They "Play" by the SAME rule like every other parties and even communists. All parties and ideas should be welcomed as long NONE of them are violent in their ways. Once a party resort to violence, they should be dealt with by local laws.

Right now, pretty much all political parties are involved in corruption and violence.

As much as I disagree with BJP, they should be allowed to share their ideas and last polls suggested that, most Indians are not supporting their ideas.

We have to have a "Level playing field" for ALL parties. Problem starts when our politicians use one law for their party members and use other laws for opponents. That is NOT democracy. We have vibrant media and they are one of the most effective safeguards to uphold democracy.

Shalom!

-----Original Message-----
From: Farida Majid <farida_majid@hotmail.com>
To: mukto-mona <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tue, Nov 27, 2012 5:36 am
Subject: RE: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat

 
 Q. Rahman. the proseletyzer wants to lecture us about democracy: <<  The beauty of democracy is people have reasonably  fair chances to judge politicians based on their performances and judge them accordingly. This "Safe guard" will guard the safety of any community. >>

O K.  Tell me, in your lecturing tone, how does a political party based on a religion function in a democracy? Where would the 'beauty' reside?  In India there is BJP flaunting the inability of Babasaheb Ambedker to stop the formation of religion-based political party from Indian Constitution due to the badmaishi of Hindu Mahasabha in 1947.  Where do you see the 'beauty' in BJP politics in the functioning of current Indian democracy? How would you show us the 'beauty' in the politics of the crooks, criminals and mass-murderers among Jamaat members in Bangladesh?

          Farida Majid

To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
From: kamalctgu@gmail.com
Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2012 06:21:51 +0600
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat

 
Jamat was banned before, and the preachers of scientific socialism, JSD, gave them shelter.  That is the reality of politics in Bangladesh.  To render a snake harmless, one should remove it's poison tooth instead of killing it.


On Mon, Nov 12, 2012 at 7:23 AM, Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com> wrote:
 

"What I meant is this: asking Jamaat to strip itself off Islamic agenda is sheer stupidity. Jamaat as its very name implies cannot go without Islam on its plate."
 
The demand of the civil society is to put Jamat out of politics. Is that a stupid demand also, in your view? You said - it will be stupidity to ask Jama


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Mukto Mona plans for a Grand Darwin Day Celebration: 
Call For Articles:

http://mukto-mona.com/wordpress/?p=68

http://mukto-mona.com/banga_blog/?p=585

****************************************************

VISIT MUKTO-MONA WEB-SITE : http://www.mukto-mona.com/

****************************************************

"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it".
               -Beatrice Hall [pseudonym: S.G. Tallentyre], 190




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Re: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat



I may not agree or like what you write, but I do find you as a good man with some interesting arguments. You have different views about many things and I respect that. I do not find any problem at all with your English as I find this forum is not restricted to only Harvard/Oxfordian English writers. In such scenario, many of us with with poorer English have to quit writing.
-SD

 
"All great truths begin as blasphemies." GBS

From: qar <qrahman@netscape.net>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, November 30, 2012 11:42 AM
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat

 
His poor grasp of English (or any language) prevented him from getting the message that we do not want any lecture on "democracy" from the likes of him or S A Hannan (a gun-runner for Islamic terrorists in BD and an ardent supporter of Genocide 1971).

>>>>>>>>> You are read many hundreds of post I have written in discussion groups. I do NOT think I ever endorsed any political parties. ALL I have said that, EVERYONE should be dealt fairly and with the SAME rule.

If evidences are credible against Jammat or any other parties, they should be punished (Common sense!). Same rule should be applied to others as well.

I am not sure what prevents some of us to grasp this very simple logic?


The beauty of democracy is people have reasonably  fair chances to judge politicians based on their performances and judge them accordingly. This "Safe guard" will guard the safety of any community. >>  We do not want to tolerate such bs anymore.

>>>>>>>>>> Not sure if you are against democracy or not. There are plenty of Christian and Jewish political parties and the world is not falling apart because of them. As long they are NOT violent, what is wrong with them?

We have to separate violence/torture from politics. Divorcing religion from politics will only make them more popular to the mass (As seen in Turkey and Egypt).


I think you are misunderstanding the message of my previous posts.


Shalom!



-----Original Message-----
From: Farida Majid <farida_majid@hotmail.com>
To: mukto-mona <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thu, Nov 29, 2012 6:08 am
Subject: RE: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat

 
  Here we go again! Q.  Rahman flattering himself! How can I, or anybody, have any 'prejudice' against him?  He is not my neighbor, relative or kutumb, or a poet, artist, musician, teacher, social worker, political activist or writer -- people I closely or loosely associate with in my real life. I only know him on the internet.  Day after day, month after month, year after year, we are exposed his dishonesty, lack of any original thinking, and plain 'munafequi' when it comes to topics on religion.
           His poor grasp of English (or any language) prevented him from getting the message that we do not want any lecture on "democracy" from the likes of him or S A Hannan (a gun-runner for Islamic terrorists in BD and an ardent supporter of Genocide 1971).

         Earlier Q Rahman  spoke in ridiculous, and utterly meaningless tautology that left unexplained what he meant by 'religion'. << The beauty of democracy is people have reasonably  fair chances to judge politicians based on their performances and judge them accordingly. This "Safe guard" will guard the safety of any community. >>  We do not want to tolerate such bs anymore.

         Let us stop the EVIL of Jamaat and all other religious parties destroying our nation by spreading murder, arson, anarchy and mayhem.             

               STOP European style fascism in the guise of Jamaat-i-Islam!


To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
From: qrahman@netscape.net
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2012 21:01:53 -0500
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat

 

  Q. Rahman. the proseletyzer wants to lecture us about democracy

>>>>>>>>> When you start this way, I must be doing pretty bad job here. You are still with your prejudices intact. :-)



O K.  Tell me, in your lecturing tone, how does a political party based on a religion function in a democracy?



>>>>>>>>>> Pretty simple if we are sincere. They "Play" by the SAME rule like every other parties and even communists. All parties and ideas should be welcomed as long NONE of them are violent in their ways. Once a party resort to violence, they should be dealt with by local laws.

Right now, pretty much all political parties are involved in corruption and violence.

As much as I disagree with BJP, they should be allowed to share their ideas and last polls suggested that, most Indians are not supporting their ideas.

We have to have a "Level playing field" for ALL parties. Problem starts when our politicians use one law for their party members and use other laws for opponents. That is NOT democracy. We have vibrant media and they are one of the most effective safeguards to uphold democracy.

Shalom!

-----Original Message-----
From: Farida Majid <farida_majid@hotmail.com>
To: mukto-mona <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tue, Nov 27, 2012 5:36 am
Subject: RE: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat

 
 Q. Rahman. the proseletyzer wants to lecture us about democracy: <<  The beauty of democracy is people have reasonably  fair chances to judge politicians based on their performances and judge them accordingly. This "Safe guard" will guard the safety of any community. >>

O K.  Tell me, in your lecturing tone, how does a political party based on a religion function in a democracy? Where would the 'beauty' reside?  In India there is BJP flaunting the inability of Babasaheb Ambedker to stop the formation of religion-based political party from Indian Constitution due to the badmaishi of Hindu Mahasabha in 1947.  Where do you see the 'beauty' in BJP politics in the functioning of current Indian democracy? How would you show us the 'beauty' in the politics of the crooks, criminals and mass-murderers among Jamaat members in Bangladesh?

          Farida Majid

To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
From: kamalctgu@gmail.com
Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2012 06:21:51 +0600
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat

 
Jamat was banned before, and the preachers of scientific socialism, JSD, gave them shelter.  That is the reality of politics in Bangladesh.  To render a snake harmless, one should remove it's poison tooth instead of killing it.


On Mon, Nov 12, 2012 at 7:23 AM, Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com> wrote:
 

"What I meant is this: asking Jamaat to strip itself off Islamic agenda is sheer stupidity. Jamaat as its very name implies cannot go without Islam on its plate."
 
The demand of the civil society is to put Jamat out of politics. Is that a stupid demand also, in your view? You said - it will be stupidity to ask Jamat not to use religion for politics - because it can't survive without religion. That's what is the ultimate goal of the civil society, Mr. Chakraborty.
The later part of your remaks indicate that you are worried about consequences of Jamati-politics in the society; yet, you are not ready to put them out of politics. What are you trying to say, Mr. smart guy?
Jiten Roy


--- On Sun, 11/11/12, Subimal Chakrabarty <subimal@yahoo.com> wrote:

From: Subimal Chakrabarty <subimal@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat
To: "mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Sunday, November 11, 2012, 6:59 PM


 
No sir. I did not say that. What I meant is this: asking Jamaat to strip itself off Islsmic agenda is sheer stupidity. Jamaat as its very name implies cannot go without Islam on its plate. Worse, the kind of Islam Jamaat caters is of worst kind. Once they come to power, they will a few Muslim sects illegal. They will not stop there. Just remember what Mr. Hannan believes. You will see all of them. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 11, 2012, at 5:35 PM, Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com> wrote:

 
What you are saying is that there is no secularism in those societies, because secular political party manifestos do not go on a head on collision with the Islamic religious edicts. That's not the criterion of secularism. You can be secular without violating tenants of Islam. A secular manifesto should comply with all religions.
If Jamat manifesto cannot do that, and becomes oxymoronic, it will cease to exist as a political party. Do not go overboard with your generalization.
Jiten Roy

--- On Sun, 11/11/12, Subimal Chakrabarty <subimal@yahoo.com> wrote:

From: Subimal Chakrabarty <subimal@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat
To: "mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Sunday, November 11, 2012, 4:01 PM

 
Jamaati politics without religious agenda is an oxymoron. The manifestos of our so called secular parties even are not free from religious agenda. For example, no law will contradict the Koran and Sunnah. This simply reflects the social reality and the existing power politics. 
Democracy is obviously not perfect. But in the absence of any other better alternatives, we will have to rely on the people's verdict. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 11, 2012, at 2:28 PM, Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com> wrote:

Very inconsistent thought! 
You want to leave the decision about politics with religion onto the people of Bangladesh, knowing that even the most educated Western countries do not leave this decision to the people. You know USA do not leave this decision to the people also. You cannot advocate such approach to a country like Bangladesh.
I know nothing will happen to Jamat, because Bangladeshi constitution is handicapped by the Awami-party amendments, and cannot force Jamat to reform their party manifesto. Ideally, Jamat should be allowed to stay as a political party without religious agenda in their political manifesto.
Jiten Roy 

--- On Sun, 11/11/12, qar <qrahman@netscape.net> wrote:

From: qar <qrahman@netscape.net>
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sunday, November 11, 2012, 1:49 PM

Your views should influence social and political conditions in the country; that's where we need them mostly, but - I still disagree with you on the point that a country should be run by a religious group. 

>>>>>>>>>>>> In a "Free" and democratic country, this sort of decisions should be left unto people of those countries. As long religious or non-religious groups are not preaching violence or hate-mongering, they should be allowed to stay within politics.

In a free, moderate, democratic country people do "Evolve" in their thinking and religious (And secular) parties have "Opportunity" to evolve as well. As long they stay away from violence, we should embrace all people. If any of them can gain trust of mainstream population, they should be offered a chance to rule.


The beauty of democracy is people have reasonably 
fair chances to judge politicians based on their performances and judge them accordingly. This "Safe guard" will guard the safety of any community.


Shalom!




Original Message-----
From: Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com>
To: mukto-mona <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sat, Nov 10, 2012 11:01 pm
Subject: RE: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat

Hannan Shaheb,
I like most of what you have said in your attached article. I like the moderation in the approach to deal with the non-Muslim in an Islamic country, which is a progressive step in the right direction. This is in keeping with the situation in the modern world, but - my worry is - these are views and interpretations of the moderate Islamic scholars, like you, and these interpretations can change suddenly under the more fundamental (strict) interpretations of the Islamic-laws. The recent example is Taliban-rules in Afghanistan. I know you disagree with the implementation of the Islamic laws by the Taliban, and I commend you for that. I strongly agree with you that Taliban rules were dead on arrival; they were 100% incompatible with the modern world.  I can't help but admire your efforts to bring moderate Islamic views into the main-stream. Your views should influence social and political conditions in the country; that's where we need them mostly, but - I still disagree with you on the point that a country should be run by a religious group. 
With best regards, 
Jiten Roy


--- On Sat, 11/10/12, SAHANNAN <sahannan@sonarbangladesh.com> wrote:

From: SAHANNAN <sahannan@sonarbangladesh.com>
Subject: RE: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat [1 Attachment]
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, November 10, 2012, 1:18 AM

 
Respected brother Jiten sb,
Best regards. I do not want to pursue the matter. Let us agreem to differ.
I explain only one point.Dhimmi is a term used to denote protected minorities in conquered territory of Muslims .
All modern Muslim states have been achieved by joint efforts of Muslims and non- Muslims against colonial masters. So there will be no Zimmi now ) Please read Rasail wa Masail by Syed Abul Ala Maududi) .There was no Zimmi in Madinan state established by Prophet as it was not conquered territory)
Please see the attached article where there is discussion on Zimmi.
 
Shah Abdul Hannan
 

From: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com [mailto: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Jiten Roy
Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2012 6:14 AM
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir ' s terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat
 
Hannan Shaheb,
 











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****************************************************
Mukto Mona plans for a Grand Darwin Day Celebration: 
Call For Articles:

http://mukto-mona.com/wordpress/?p=68

http://mukto-mona.com/banga_blog/?p=585

****************************************************

VISIT MUKTO-MONA WEB-SITE : http://www.mukto-mona.com/

****************************************************

"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it".
               -Beatrice Hall [pseudonym: S.G. Tallentyre], 190




Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional
Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required)
Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured
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Re: [mukto-mona] বুয়েটে নাশকতা চালাতে এসে ধরা পড়ল শিবির ক্যাডার !!!!!!!



Nerds need company! Many of these great students are socially handicapped and need something apart from their Math and Physics text books. For them to get a great girl is to be good in studies and great with the religion. Our middle class families still appreciate these kind of idiotic qualities in their future son in laws. What else could it be? Freudian Psychology at works?
-SD
 
"All great truths begin as blasphemies." GBS

From: Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, November 30, 2012 8:10 PM
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] বুয়েটে নাশকতা চালাতে এসে ধরা পড়ল শিবির ক্যাডার !!!!!!!

 
Bangladesh Engineering University at Dhaka has been the center for Toblique Party forever. I saw during 1968 – 1971, when schools, colleges, and universities in Bangladesh were swept by the spirit of Bengali Nationalism, most of the students in this University stood still on the fringe. I have been trying to understand the reason for it ever since I became a resident at Jagannath Hall, Dhaka University, in 1968. During those days, you needed to have average score at least 75% in the SSC and HSC examinations to appear at the admission test of the civil engineering department. Therefore, most of these students did very well in schools and colleges they come from. They did not come from ordinary families also; they were not poor or illiterate people, and, I am sure, none of these students had any Madrassa education. Then, how did they get indoctrinated into Tolique-Party? I haven't been able to find an explanation for it, even today. Do you?
Jiten Roy
 

--- On Fri, 11/30/12, Muhammad Ali <man1k195709@yahoo.com> wrote:

From: Muhammad Ali <man1k195709@yahoo.com>
Subject: [mukto-mona] বুয়েটে নাশকতা চালাতে এসে ধরা পড়ল শিবির ক্যাডার !!!!!!!
To:
Date: Friday, November 30, 2012, 6:15 PM

 
বুয়েটে নাশকতা চালাতে এসে ধরা পড়ল শিবির ক্যাডার
স্টাফ রিপোর্টার ॥ ভর্তি পরীক্ষার সময়ে ক্যাম্পাসে কর্মকা- চালাতে এসে শুক্রবার রাতে হাতেনাতে ধরা পড়েছে বুয়েটের এক শিবির ক্যাডার আই এম ইকবাল। সম্প্রতি শিবিরের তা-বে এই শিবির ক্যাডারের সংশ্লিষ্টতার বিষয়টি আঁচ করতে পেরে তাকে ধরে আইনশৃঙ্খলা রক্ষা বাহিনীর হাতে তুলে দিয়েছেন ছাত্রলীগের নেতাকর্মীরা। আহছান উল্লাহ হলের ১০৩ নম্বর কক্ষের এই শিবির ক্যাডার সিভিল ইঞ্জিনিয়ারিং বিভাগের ছাত্র। সম্প্রতি বুয়েটে ৫৯ শিবির সদস্যের যে গোপন তালিকা উদ্ধার করা হয়েছে তাতে নাম আছে ইকবালের। এদিকে তার মোবাইল ফোনে শিক্ষা প্রতিষ্ঠানে নাশকতার পরিকল্পনার আলামত পাওয়া গেছে। মোবাইল থেকে পাঠানো মেসেজে বলা হয়েছে, 'গুলি লাঠিচার্জ বুলেট টিয়ারশেল কোন কিছুতেই পিছপা হওয়া যাবে না। মরলে শহীদ, বাঁচলে গাজী।'
এদিকে রাতে এই শিবির ক্যাডার পুলিশ ও সাধারণ শিক্ষার্থীদের কাছে বলেছে, বুয়েটের সাম্প্রতিক আন্দোলন ছিল তাদের পরিকল্পনার ফসল। যেখানে মূল নেতৃত্বে ছিলেন তাদের সংগঠনের সঙ্গে সম্পৃক্ত বুয়েটের চার শিক্ষক। তাঁরা সংগঠনকে আর্থিকভাবেও সহায়তা করেন নিয়মিত। চার শিক্ষকের নামও প্রকাশ করেছে এই শিবির ক্যডার। সম্প্রতি আটক শিবির ক্যাডার শফিকুল ইসলামের ফেসবুক ও মেইলেও এই চার শিক্ষকের নাম পাওয়া গিয়েছিল। ফেসবুকে তথ্যপ্রমাণ পাওয়া অভিযুক্ত শিক্ষকরা হচ্ছেন ড. মহবুব রাজ্জাক, ড, জাহাঙ্গীর, স্নিগ্ধা আফসানা, মোহাম্মদ আলী। এদের প্রত্যেককেই নিজেদের লোক বলে দাবি করেছে আটক শিবির ক্যাডার। ঘটনা ইতোমধ্যেই তদন্তে নেমেছে পুুলিশ। এর আগে দেশব্যাপী জামায়াত-শিবিরের তা-ব চালানোর সময় রাজধানীতে আটক শিবির ক্যাডার বুয়েট ছাত্র শফিকুল ইসলামের কম্পিউটার, ফেসবুক, ই-মেইলসহ কাগজপত্র প্রমাণ করে বুয়েটে জামায়াত-শিবির গড়ে তুলেছে শক্তিশালী নেটওয়ার্ক। যেখানে একসঙ্গে কাজ করছে হিযবুত তাহ্রীর। কেবল তাই নয়, এতদিন নিজেদের চেহারা লুকিয়ে 'সাধারণ শিক্ষক' বলে দাবি করলেও শিবির ক্যাডারসহ পুরো শিবিরের সঙ্গে অন্তত চার শিক্ষকের সরাসরি সম্পৃক্ত থাকার প্রমাণ মেলে। যাঁরা শিবিরকে অর্থ যোগানসহ সকল কাজে উপদেষ্টার মতো কাজ করছেন। যেসব শিক্ষক শিবির ক্যাডারদের সঙ্গে ই-মেইল ও ফেসবুকের মাধ্যমে মিলিত হয়ে শিক্ষক আন্দোলনে নেতৃত্ব দিয়েছেন অথচ বলেছিলেন 'এই আন্দোলন মৌলবাদীদের নয়'। তাদের বিভ্রান্তিকর প্রচারণায় বিভ্রান্ত হয়ে সেদিন সুশীল সমাজেরও অনেকে উগ্রবাদী এসব শিক্ষক-ছাত্রকে আওয়ামী লীগের অবিচল সমর্থক মনে করেছিলেন। রাজধানীর মৌচাক থেকে বুয়েটের সিভিল ইঞ্জিনিয়ারিং বিভাগের ছাত্র শিবির ক্যাডার শফিকুল ইসলামকে আটক করেছিল রমনা থানা পুলিশ। সোহরাওয়ার্দী হলের ২০০৮ নম্বর কক্ষের এই শিবির ক্যাডারকে ইতোমধ্যেই রিমান্ডে নেয়া হয়েছে। শফিকুলকে আটকের পর সোহরাওয়ার্দী হলের ২০০৮ ও ২০১১ নম্বর কক্ষে তল্লাশি চালায় বুয়েটের সাধারণ শিক্ষার্থী ও কর্তৃপক্ষ। সেদিন কক্ষ দুটি থেকে বিপুল পরিমাণ জেহাদী বই, পুস্তক, সিডি উদ্ধার করা হয়। উদ্ধার করা হয় একটি কম্পিউটার ও শিবির ক্যাডারের একটি ডায়েরি। পরদিন রাতে আইনশৃঙ্খলা রক্ষা বাহিনীর উপস্থিতিতে অপর শিবির ক্যাডার আমিনুল ইসলামের ১০৮ নম্বর কক্ষে আবার অভিযান চালাল বুয়েটের ছাত্ররা। আমিনুল পালিয়ে গেলেও উদ্ধার হয় রামদা, গোলাবারুদ, জেহাদী বইসহ বেশ কিছু আলামত। শিবিরের তা-ব ও ক্যাম্পাসের কর্মকা- প্রকাশ হয়ে পড়ার পর বুয়েটে ক'দিন ধরেই উত্তপ্ত অবস্থা বিরাজ করছে। আতঙ্ক ছড়িয়ে পড়েছে সাধারণ শিক্ষক-শিক্ষার্থী ও কর্মকর্তা-কর্মচারীদের মাঝে।




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Re: [mukto-mona] বুয়েটে নাশকতা চালাতে এসে ধরা পড়ল শিবির ক্যাডার !!!!!!!



Bangladesh Engineering University at Dhaka has been the center for Toblique Party forever. I saw during 1968 – 1971, when schools, colleges, and universities in Bangladesh were swept by the spirit of Bengali Nationalism, most of the students in this University stood still on the fringe. I have been trying to understand the reason for it ever since I became a resident at Jagannath Hall, Dhaka University, in 1968. During those days, you needed to have average score at least 75% in the SSC and HSC examinations to appear at the admission test of the civil engineering department. Therefore, most of these students did very well in schools and colleges they come from. They did not come from ordinary families also; they were not poor or illiterate people, and, I am sure, none of these students had any Madrassa education. Then, how did they get indoctrinated into Tolique-Party? I haven't been able to find an explanation for it, even today. Do you?

Jiten Roy

 

--- On Fri, 11/30/12, Muhammad Ali <man1k195709@yahoo.com> wrote:

From: Muhammad Ali <man1k195709@yahoo.com>
Subject: [mukto-mona] বুয়েটে নাশকতা চালাতে এসে ধরা পড়ল শিবির ক্যাডার !!!!!!!
To:
Date: Friday, November 30, 2012, 6:15 PM

 
বুয়েটে নাশকতা চালাতে এসে ধরা পড়ল শিবির ক্যাডার
স্টাফ রিপোর্টার ॥ ভর্তি পরীক্ষার সময়ে ক্যাম্পাসে কর্মকা- চালাতে এসে শুক্রবার রাতে হাতেনাতে ধরা পড়েছে বুয়েটের এক শিবির ক্যাডার আই এম ইকবাল। সম্প্রতি শিবিরের তা-বে এই শিবির ক্যাডারের সংশ্লিষ্টতার বিষয়টি আঁচ করতে পেরে তাকে ধরে আইনশৃঙ্খলা রক্ষা বাহিনীর হাতে তুলে দিয়েছেন ছাত্রলীগের নেতাকর্মীরা। আহছান উল্লাহ হলের ১০৩ নম্বর কক্ষের এই শিবির ক্যাডার সিভিল ইঞ্জিনিয়ারিং বিভাগের ছাত্র। সম্প্রতি বুয়েটে ৫৯ শিবির সদস্যের যে গোপন তালিকা উদ্ধার করা হয়েছে তাতে নাম আছে ইকবালের। এদিকে তার মোবাইল ফোনে শিক্ষা প্রতিষ্ঠানে নাশকতার পরিকল্পনার আলামত পাওয়া গেছে। মোবাইল থেকে পাঠানো মেসেজে বলা হয়েছে, 'গুলি লাঠিচার্জ বুলেট টিয়ারশেল কোন কিছুতেই পিছপা হওয়া যাবে না। মরলে শহীদ, বাঁচলে গাজী।'
এদিকে রাতে এই শিবির ক্যাডার পুলিশ ও সাধারণ শিক্ষার্থীদের কাছে বলেছে, বুয়েটের সাম্প্রতিক আন্দোলন ছিল তাদের পরিকল্পনার ফসল। যেখানে মূল নেতৃত্বে ছিলেন তাদের সংগঠনের সঙ্গে সম্পৃক্ত বুয়েটের চার শিক্ষক। তাঁরা সংগঠনকে আর্থিকভাবেও সহায়তা করেন নিয়মিত। চার শিক্ষকের নামও প্রকাশ করেছে এই শিবির ক্যডার। সম্প্রতি আটক শিবির ক্যাডার শফিকুল ইসলামের ফেসবুক ও মেইলেও এই চার শিক্ষকের নাম পাওয়া গিয়েছিল। ফেসবুকে তথ্যপ্রমাণ পাওয়া অভিযুক্ত শিক্ষকরা হচ্ছেন ড. মহবুব রাজ্জাক, ড, জাহাঙ্গীর, স্নিগ্ধা আফসানা, মোহাম্মদ আলী। এদের প্রত্যেককেই নিজেদের লোক বলে দাবি করেছে আটক শিবির ক্যাডার। ঘটনা ইতোমধ্যেই তদন্তে নেমেছে পুুলিশ। এর আগে দেশব্যাপী জামায়াত-শিবিরের তা-ব চালানোর সময় রাজধানীতে আটক শিবির ক্যাডার বুয়েট ছাত্র শফিকুল ইসলামের কম্পিউটার, ফেসবুক, ই-মেইলসহ কাগজপত্র প্রমাণ করে বুয়েটে জামায়াত-শিবির গড়ে তুলেছে শক্তিশালী নেটওয়ার্ক। যেখানে একসঙ্গে কাজ করছে হিযবুত তাহ্রীর। কেবল তাই নয়, এতদিন নিজেদের চেহারা লুকিয়ে 'সাধারণ শিক্ষক' বলে দাবি করলেও শিবির ক্যাডারসহ পুরো শিবিরের সঙ্গে অন্তত চার শিক্ষকের সরাসরি সম্পৃক্ত থাকার প্রমাণ মেলে। যাঁরা শিবিরকে অর্থ যোগানসহ সকল কাজে উপদেষ্টার মতো কাজ করছেন। যেসব শিক্ষক শিবির ক্যাডারদের সঙ্গে ই-মেইল ও ফেসবুকের মাধ্যমে মিলিত হয়ে শিক্ষক আন্দোলনে নেতৃত্ব দিয়েছেন অথচ বলেছিলেন 'এই আন্দোলন মৌলবাদীদের নয়'। তাদের বিভ্রান্তিকর প্রচারণায় বিভ্রান্ত হয়ে সেদিন সুশীল সমাজেরও অনেকে উগ্রবাদী এসব শিক্ষক-ছাত্রকে আওয়ামী লীগের অবিচল সমর্থক মনে করেছিলেন। রাজধানীর মৌচাক থেকে বুয়েটের সিভিল ইঞ্জিনিয়ারিং বিভাগের ছাত্র শিবির ক্যাডার শফিকুল ইসলামকে আটক করেছিল রমনা থানা পুলিশ। সোহরাওয়ার্দী হলের ২০০৮ নম্বর কক্ষের এই শিবির ক্যাডারকে ইতোমধ্যেই রিমান্ডে নেয়া হয়েছে। শফিকুলকে আটকের পর সোহরাওয়ার্দী হলের ২০০৮ ও ২০১১ নম্বর কক্ষে তল্লাশি চালায় বুয়েটের সাধারণ শিক্ষার্থী ও কর্তৃপক্ষ। সেদিন কক্ষ দুটি থেকে বিপুল পরিমাণ জেহাদী বই, পুস্তক, সিডি উদ্ধার করা হয়। উদ্ধার করা হয় একটি কম্পিউটার ও শিবির ক্যাডারের একটি ডায়েরি। পরদিন রাতে আইনশৃঙ্খলা রক্ষা বাহিনীর উপস্থিতিতে অপর শিবির ক্যাডার আমিনুল ইসলামের ১০৮ নম্বর কক্ষে আবার অভিযান চালাল বুয়েটের ছাত্ররা। আমিনুল পালিয়ে গেলেও উদ্ধার হয় রামদা, গোলাবারুদ, জেহাদী বইসহ বেশ কিছু আলামত। শিবিরের তা-ব ও ক্যাম্পাসের কর্মকা- প্রকাশ হয়ে পড়ার পর বুয়েটে ক'দিন ধরেই উত্তপ্ত অবস্থা বিরাজ করছে। আতঙ্ক ছড়িয়ে পড়েছে সাধারণ শিক্ষক-শিক্ষার্থী ও কর্মকর্তা-কর্মচারীদের মাঝে।


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Mukto Mona plans for a Grand Darwin Day Celebration: 
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http://mukto-mona.com/wordpress/?p=68

http://mukto-mona.com/banga_blog/?p=585

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               -Beatrice Hall [pseudonym: S.G. Tallentyre], 190




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[mukto-mona] বুয়েটে নাশকতা চালাতে এসে ধরা পড়ল শিবির ক্যাডার !!!!!!!



বুয়েটে নাশকতা চালাতে এসে ধরা পড়ল শিবির ক্যাডার
স্টাফ রিপোর্টার ॥ ভর্তি পরীক্ষার সময়ে ক্যাম্পাসে কর্মকা- চালাতে এসে শুক্রবার রাতে হাতেনাতে ধরা পড়েছে বুয়েটের এক শিবির ক্যাডার আই এম ইকবাল। সম্প্রতি শিবিরের তা-বে এই শিবির ক্যাডারের সংশ্লিষ্টতার বিষয়টি আঁচ করতে পেরে তাকে ধরে আইনশৃঙ্খলা রক্ষা বাহিনীর হাতে তুলে দিয়েছেন ছাত্রলীগের নেতাকর্মীরা। আহছান উল্লাহ হলের ১০৩ নম্বর কক্ষের এই শিবির ক্যাডার সিভিল ইঞ্জিনিয়ারিং বিভাগের ছাত্র। সম্প্রতি বুয়েটে ৫৯ শিবির সদস্যের যে গোপন তালিকা উদ্ধার করা হয়েছে তাতে নাম আছে ইকবালের। এদিকে তার মোবাইল ফোনে শিক্ষা প্রতিষ্ঠানে নাশকতার পরিকল্পনার আলামত পাওয়া গেছে। মোবাইল থেকে পাঠানো মেসেজে বলা হয়েছে, 'গুলি লাঠিচার্জ বুলেট টিয়ারশেল কোন কিছুতেই পিছপা হওয়া যাবে না। মরলে শহীদ, বাঁচলে গাজী।'
এদিকে রাতে এই শিবির ক্যাডার পুলিশ ও সাধারণ শিক্ষার্থীদের কাছে বলেছে, বুয়েটের সাম্প্রতিক আন্দোলন ছিল তাদের পরিকল্পনার ফসল। যেখানে মূল নেতৃত্বে ছিলেন তাদের সংগঠনের সঙ্গে সম্পৃক্ত বুয়েটের চার শিক্ষক। তাঁরা সংগঠনকে আর্থিকভাবেও সহায়তা করেন নিয়মিত। চার শিক্ষকের নামও প্রকাশ করেছে এই শিবির ক্যডার। সম্প্রতি আটক শিবির ক্যাডার শফিকুল ইসলামের ফেসবুক ও মেইলেও এই চার শিক্ষকের নাম পাওয়া গিয়েছিল। ফেসবুকে তথ্যপ্রমাণ পাওয়া অভিযুক্ত শিক্ষকরা হচ্ছেন ড. মহবুব রাজ্জাক, ড, জাহাঙ্গীর, স্নিগ্ধা আফসানা, মোহাম্মদ আলী। এদের প্রত্যেককেই নিজেদের লোক বলে দাবি করেছে আটক শিবির ক্যাডার। ঘটনা ইতোমধ্যেই তদন্তে নেমেছে পুুলিশ। এর আগে দেশব্যাপী জামায়াত-শিবিরের তা-ব চালানোর সময় রাজধানীতে আটক শিবির ক্যাডার বুয়েট ছাত্র শফিকুল ইসলামের কম্পিউটার, ফেসবুক, ই-মেইলসহ কাগজপত্র প্রমাণ করে বুয়েটে জামায়াত-শিবির গড়ে তুলেছে শক্তিশালী নেটওয়ার্ক। যেখানে একসঙ্গে কাজ করছে হিযবুত তাহ্রীর। কেবল তাই নয়, এতদিন নিজেদের চেহারা লুকিয়ে 'সাধারণ শিক্ষক' বলে দাবি করলেও শিবির ক্যাডারসহ পুরো শিবিরের সঙ্গে অন্তত চার শিক্ষকের সরাসরি সম্পৃক্ত থাকার প্রমাণ মেলে। যাঁরা শিবিরকে অর্থ যোগানসহ সকল কাজে উপদেষ্টার মতো কাজ করছেন। যেসব শিক্ষক শিবির ক্যাডারদের সঙ্গে ই-মেইল ও ফেসবুকের মাধ্যমে মিলিত হয়ে শিক্ষক আন্দোলনে নেতৃত্ব দিয়েছেন অথচ বলেছিলেন 'এই আন্দোলন মৌলবাদীদের নয়'। তাদের বিভ্রান্তিকর প্রচারণায় বিভ্রান্ত হয়ে সেদিন সুশীল সমাজেরও অনেকে উগ্রবাদী এসব শিক্ষক-ছাত্রকে আওয়ামী লীগের অবিচল সমর্থক মনে করেছিলেন। রাজধানীর মৌচাক থেকে বুয়েটের সিভিল ইঞ্জিনিয়ারিং বিভাগের ছাত্র শিবির ক্যাডার শফিকুল ইসলামকে আটক করেছিল রমনা থানা পুলিশ। সোহরাওয়ার্দী হলের ২০০৮ নম্বর কক্ষের এই শিবির ক্যাডারকে ইতোমধ্যেই রিমান্ডে নেয়া হয়েছে। শফিকুলকে আটকের পর সোহরাওয়ার্দী হলের ২০০৮ ও ২০১১ নম্বর কক্ষে তল্লাশি চালায় বুয়েটের সাধারণ শিক্ষার্থী ও কর্তৃপক্ষ। সেদিন কক্ষ দুটি থেকে বিপুল পরিমাণ জেহাদী বই, পুস্তক, সিডি উদ্ধার করা হয়। উদ্ধার করা হয় একটি কম্পিউটার ও শিবির ক্যাডারের একটি ডায়েরি। পরদিন রাতে আইনশৃঙ্খলা রক্ষা বাহিনীর উপস্থিতিতে অপর শিবির ক্যাডার আমিনুল ইসলামের ১০৮ নম্বর কক্ষে আবার অভিযান চালাল বুয়েটের ছাত্ররা। আমিনুল পালিয়ে গেলেও উদ্ধার হয় রামদা, গোলাবারুদ, জেহাদী বইসহ বেশ কিছু আলামত। শিবিরের তা-ব ও ক্যাম্পাসের কর্মকা- প্রকাশ হয়ে পড়ার পর বুয়েটে ক'দিন ধরেই উত্তপ্ত অবস্থা বিরাজ করছে। আতঙ্ক ছড়িয়ে পড়েছে সাধারণ শিক্ষক-শিক্ষার্থী ও কর্মকর্তা-কর্মচারীদের মাঝে।


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Re: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat



His poor grasp of English (or any language) prevented him from getting the message that we do not want any lecture on "democracy" from the likes of him or S A Hannan (a gun-runner for Islamic terrorists in BD and an ardent supporter of Genocide 1971).

>>>>>>>>> You are read many hundreds of post I have written in discussion groups. I do NOT think I ever endorsed any political parties. ALL I have said that, EVERYONE should be dealt fairly and with the SAME rule.

If evidences are credible against Jammat or any other parties, they should be punished (Common sense!). Same rule should be applied to others as well.

I am not sure what prevents some of us to grasp this very simple logic?


The beauty of democracy is people have reasonably  fair chances to judge politicians based on their performances and judge them accordingly. This "Safe guard" will guard the safety of any community. >>  We do not want to tolerate such bs anymore.

>>>>>>>>>> Not sure if you are against democracy or not. There are plenty of Christian and Jewish political parties and the world is not falling apart because of them. As long they are NOT violent, what is wrong with them?

We have to separate violence/torture from politics. Divorcing religion from politics will only make them more popular to the mass (As seen in Turkey and Egypt).


I think you are misunderstanding the message of my previous posts.


Shalom!



-----Original Message-----
From: Farida Majid <farida_majid@hotmail.com>
To: mukto-mona <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thu, Nov 29, 2012 6:08 am
Subject: RE: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat

 
  Here we go again! Q.  Rahman flattering himself! How can I, or anybody, have any 'prejudice' against him?  He is not my neighbor, relative or kutumb, or a poet, artist, musician, teacher, social worker, political activist or writer -- people I closely or loosely associate with in my real life. I only know him on the internet.  Day after day, month after month, year after year, we are exposed his dishonesty, lack of any original thinking, and plain 'munafequi' when it comes to topics on religion.
           His poor grasp of English (or any language) prevented him from getting the message that we do not want any lecture on "democracy" from the likes of him or S A Hannan (a gun-runner for Islamic terrorists in BD and an ardent supporter of Genocide 1971).

         Earlier Q Rahman  spoke in ridiculous, and utterly meaningless tautology that left unexplained what he meant by 'religion'. << The beauty of democracy is people have reasonably  fair chances to judge politicians based on their performances and judge them accordingly. This "Safe guard" will guard the safety of any community. >>  We do not want to tolerate such bs anymore.

         Let us stop the EVIL of Jamaat and all other religious parties destroying our nation by spreading murder, arson, anarchy and mayhem.             

               STOP European style fascism in the guise of Jamaat-i-Islam!


To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
From: qrahman@netscape.net
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2012 21:01:53 -0500
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat

 

  Q. Rahman. the proseletyzer wants to lecture us about democracy

>>>>>>>>> When you start this way, I must be doing pretty bad job here. You are still with your prejudices intact. :-)



O K.  Tell me, in your lecturing tone, how does a political party based on a religion function in a democracy?



>>>>>>>>>> Pretty simple if we are sincere. They "Play" by the SAME rule like every other parties and even communists. All parties and ideas should be welcomed as long NONE of them are violent in their ways. Once a party resort to violence, they should be dealt with by local laws.

Right now, pretty much all political parties are involved in corruption and violence.

As much as I disagree with BJP, they should be allowed to share their ideas and last polls suggested that, most Indians are not supporting their ideas.

We have to have a "Level playing field" for ALL parties. Problem starts when our politicians use one law for their party members and use other laws for opponents. That is NOT democracy. We have vibrant media and they are one of the most effective safeguards to uphold democracy.

Shalom!

-----Original Message-----
From: Farida Majid <farida_majid@hotmail.com>
To: mukto-mona <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tue, Nov 27, 2012 5:36 am
Subject: RE: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat

 
 Q. Rahman. the proseletyzer wants to lecture us about democracy: <<  The beauty of democracy is people have reasonably  fair chances to judge politicians based on their performances and judge them accordingly. This "Safe guard" will guard the safety of any community. >>

O K.  Tell me, in your lecturing tone, how does a political party based on a religion function in a democracy? Where would the 'beauty' reside?  In India there is BJP flaunting the inability of Babasaheb Ambedker to stop the formation of religion-based political party from Indian Constitution due to the badmaishi of Hindu Mahasabha in 1947.  Where do you see the 'beauty' in BJP politics in the functioning of current Indian democracy? How would you show us the 'beauty' in the politics of the crooks, criminals and mass-murderers among Jamaat members in Bangladesh?

          Farida Majid

To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
From: kamalctgu@gmail.com
Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2012 06:21:51 +0600
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat

 
Jamat was banned before, and the preachers of scientific socialism, JSD, gave them shelter.  That is the reality of politics in Bangladesh.  To render a snake harmless, one should remove it's poison tooth instead of killing it.


On Mon, Nov 12, 2012 at 7:23 AM, Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com> wrote:
 

"What I meant is this: asking Jamaat to strip itself off Islamic agenda is sheer stupidity. Jamaat as its very name implies cannot go without Islam on its plate."
 
The demand of the civil society is to put Jamat out of politics. Is that a stupid demand also, in your view? You said - it will be stupidity to ask Jamat not to use religion for politics - because it can't survive without religion. That's what is the ultimate goal of the civil society, Mr. Chakraborty.
The later part of your remaks indicate that you are worried about consequences of Jamati-politics in the society; yet, you are not ready to put them out of politics. What are you trying to say, Mr. smart guy?
Jiten Roy


--- On Sun, 11/11/12, Subimal Chakrabarty <subimal@yahoo.com> wrote:

From: Subimal Chakrabarty <subimal@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat
To: "mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Sunday, November 11, 2012, 6:59 PM


 
No sir. I did not say that. What I meant is this: asking Jamaat to strip itself off Islsmic agenda is sheer stupidity. Jamaat as its very name implies cannot go without Islam on its plate. Worse, the kind of Islam Jamaat caters is of worst kind. Once they come to power, they will a few Muslim sects illegal. They will not stop there. Just remember what Mr. Hannan believes. You will see all of them. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 11, 2012, at 5:35 PM, Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com> wrote:

 
What you are saying is that there is no secularism in those societies, because secular political party manifestos do not go on a head on collision with the Islamic religious edicts. That's not the criterion of secularism. You can be secular without violating tenants of Islam. A secular manifesto should comply with all religions.
If Jamat manifesto cannot do that, and becomes oxymoronic, it will cease to exist as a political party. Do not go overboard with your generalization.
Jiten Roy

--- On Sun, 11/11/12, Subimal Chakrabarty <subimal@yahoo.com> wrote:

From: Subimal Chakrabarty <subimal@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat
To: "mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Sunday, November 11, 2012, 4:01 PM

 
Jamaati politics without religious agenda is an oxymoron. The manifestos of our so called secular parties even are not free from religious agenda. For example, no law will contradict the Koran and Sunnah. This simply reflects the social reality and the existing power politics. 
Democracy is obviously not perfect. But in the absence of any other better alternatives, we will have to rely on the people's verdict. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 11, 2012, at 2:28 PM, Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com> wrote:

Very inconsistent thought! 
You want to leave the decision about politics with religion onto the people of Bangladesh, knowing that even the most educated Western countries do not leave this decision to the people. You know USA do not leave this decision to the people also. You cannot advocate such approach to a country like Bangladesh.
I know nothing will happen to Jamat, because Bangladeshi constitution is handicapped by the Awami-party amendments, and cannot force Jamat to reform their party manifesto. Ideally, Jamat should be allowed to stay as a political party without religious agenda in their political manifesto.
Jiten Roy 

--- On Sun, 11/11/12, qar <qrahman@netscape.net> wrote:

From: qar <qrahman@netscape.net>
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sunday, November 11, 2012, 1:49 PM

Your views should influence social and political conditions in the country; that's where we need them mostly, but - I still disagree with you on the point that a country should be run by a religious group. 

>>>>>>>>>>>> In a "Free" and democratic country, this sort of decisions should be left unto people of those countries. As long religious or non-religious groups are not preaching violence or hate-mongering, they should be allowed to stay within politics.

In a free, moderate, democratic country people do "Evolve" in their thinking and religious (And secular) parties have "Opportunity" to evolve as well. As long they stay away from violence, we should embrace all people. If any of them can gain trust of mainstream population, they should be offered a chance to rule.


The beauty of democracy is people have reasonably 
fair chances to judge politicians based on their performances and judge them accordingly. This "Safe guard" will guard the safety of any community.


Shalom!




Original Message-----
From: Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com>
To: mukto-mona <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sat, Nov 10, 2012 11:01 pm
Subject: RE: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat

Hannan Shaheb,
I like most of what you have said in your attached article. I like the moderation in the approach to deal with the non-Muslim in an Islamic country, which is a progressive step in the right direction. This is in keeping with the situation in the modern world, but - my worry is - these are views and interpretations of the moderate Islamic scholars, like you, and these interpretations can change suddenly under the more fundamental (strict) interpretations of the Islamic-laws. The recent example is Taliban-rules in Afghanistan. I know you disagree with the implementation of the Islamic laws by the Taliban, and I commend you for that. I strongly agree with you that Taliban rules were dead on arrival; they were 100% incompatible with the modern world.  I can't help but admire your efforts to bring moderate Islamic views into the main-stream. Your views should influence social and political conditions in the country; that's where we need them mostly, but - I still disagree with you on the point that a country should be run by a religious group. 
With best regards, 
Jiten Roy


--- On Sat, 11/10/12, SAHANNAN <sahannan@sonarbangladesh.com> wrote:

From: SAHANNAN <sahannan@sonarbangladesh.com>
Subject: RE: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir's terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat [1 Attachment]
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, November 10, 2012, 1:18 AM

 
Respected brother Jiten sb,
Best regards. I do not want to pursue the matter. Let us agreem to differ.
I explain only one point.Dhimmi is a term used to denote protected minorities in conquered territory of Muslims .
All modern Muslim states have been achieved by joint efforts of Muslims and non- Muslims against colonial masters. So there will be no Zimmi now ) Please read Rasail wa Masail by Syed Abul Ala Maududi) .There was no Zimmi in Madinan state established by Prophet as it was not conquered territory)
Please see the attached article where there is discussion on Zimmi.
 
Shah Abdul Hannan
 

From: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com [mailto: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Jiten Roy
Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2012 6:14 AM
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [mukto-mona] Civil Society if favour of banning Jamaat-Shibir ' s terroristic politics !!--The left and secular elements always wanted banning Jamaat
 
Hannan Shaheb,
 









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****************************************************
Mukto Mona plans for a Grand Darwin Day Celebration: 
Call For Articles:

http://mukto-mona.com/wordpress/?p=68

http://mukto-mona.com/banga_blog/?p=585

****************************************************

VISIT MUKTO-MONA WEB-SITE : http://www.mukto-mona.com/

****************************************************

"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it".
               -Beatrice Hall [pseudonym: S.G. Tallentyre], 190




Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional
Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required)
Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured
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