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Thursday, February 27, 2014

[mukto-mona] documents [1 Attachment]

[Attachment(s) from Su Supto included below]



মুক্তমনা এডমিন, একটি লেখা পাঠালাম। অনুগ্রহ করে সংরক্ষণ করুন।
ধন্যবাদ।

-সুষুপ্ত পাঠক


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Mukto Mona plans for a Grand Darwin Day Celebration: 
Call For Articles:

http://mukto-mona.com/wordpress/?p=68

http://mukto-mona.com/banga_blog/?p=585

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VISIT MUKTO-MONA WEB-SITE : http://www.mukto-mona.com/

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"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it".
               -Beatrice Hall [pseudonym: S.G. Tallentyre], 190





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Re: [mukto-mona] ভারতকে দেয়া কথা রাখছেন কা.সিদ্দিকি!



No Mr. Q. R, not only big brother India, some big brothers from Europe are also against strengthening the hands of Jamat-e-Islami. I hope the external pressure or request will have positive impact on our future politics. Jamat-e-Islam should be banned. I hope AL will do it during it's present term. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 27, 2014, at 3:16 AM, QR <qrahman@netscape.net> wrote:

 

সূত্র জানায়, 'আওয়ামী লীগের নেতৃত্বাধীন সরকারের অধীনে অনুষ্ঠিত গত ৫ জানুয়ারির জাতীয় সংসদ নির্বাচনে কাদের সিদ্দিকির দলকে অংশ নিতে বলেন প্রণব মুখার্জি। নির্বাচনে অংশ না নিলেও ওই সরকারের 'বড়ো রকমের' বিরোধিতা না করতেও বলেন প্রণব


সূত্র জানায়, 'প্রণব মুখার্জিকে ভারত সফরে গিয়ে কাদের সিদ্দিকি প্রতিশ্রুতি দেন, জঙ্গিবাদ, মৌলবাদের পক্ষে যায়, এমন রাজনীতিকে তিনি আর সমর্থন করবেন না। এর কারণে তিনি বিএনপি, জামায়াতের নেতৃত্বাধীন ১৯ দলের জোটে যোগ দেননি। ৫ জানুয়ারির সংসদ নির্বাচনের মাত্র দশদিন আগে বদরুদ্দোজা চৌধুরির বিকল্প ধারা, আ স ম আবদুর রবের জেএসডি, কাদের সিদ্দিকির কৃষক শ্রমিক জনতা লিগ- এ তিন রাজনৈতিক দল মিলে গত ২৬ ডিসেম্বর গঠিত হয় নতুন রাজনৈতিক জোট ন্যাশনাল ডেমোক্রেটিক ফ্রন্ট (এনডিএফ)।'

সূত্রমতে, 'কাদের সিদ্দিকি গত ২৫ নভেম্বর এমন দিন ভারত সফরে যান, যেদিন সন্ধ্যায় দশম জাতীয় সংসদ নির্বাচনের তফসিল ঘোষিত হয়। বিএনপির নেতৃত্বাধীন জোটের নেতাদের অভিযোগ, নির্বাচন কমিশন একতরফাভাবে নির্বাচনের তফসিল ঘোষণা করে। এছাড়া জোট এ তফসিল প্রত্যাখান করে পরদিন থেকে প্রথম দফায় ৪৮ ঘণ্টার অবরোধ কর্মসূচি ঘোষণা করে। এসব কর্মসূচিতে কাদের সিদ্দিকির দলকে পায়নি জোট।'

তথ্যমতে, 'কাদের সিদ্দিকি ২৫ নভেম্বর হঠাৎ করে ভারত সফরে যান। ভারতের রাষ্ট্রপতি প্রণব মুখোপাধ্যায়ের সঙ্গে দেখা করতে তিনি ভারত যান বলে তার দল থেকে দাবি করা হয়। ভারতে গিয়ে প্রণবের সঙ্গে কা. সিদ্দিকি বৈঠক করেন।'



>>>>>>>> I am glad our big brother Pronob is looking after our country. Maybe he is spending too much time into it. After all according to recent polls his own party Congress is heading towards a beating in next upcoming election (Unless he can arrange a one party election).

Either way it is assuring that Pronob is deeply involved in our domestic politics by setting up how much "opposition" should our opposition parties should be doing.


Pronob babu sacrificed his own precious time since our politicians quit thinking about us, it is a hidden blessing indeed. Other sources also credited Pronob for "Managing" our "Thuthu baba" (AKA Ershad) to agree with last election.

Thank you Sri Pronob Mukharjee for being so thoughtful and thank you member Khan for sharing this precious article with us. For last few days, I thought everyone abandoned us. I am revealed that, India still deeply involved in our affairs and we have nothing to worry!!

For those who badmouth politicians should thank Mr. Kader Siddiqi. At least he is true to his "Protectors". He is not a "Nimakharam" person but a grateful person.


অনেকের মতে, 'গত চার দলের জোট সরকারের আমলে কাদের সিদ্দিকির প্রতিষ্ঠান সোনার বাংলা কনস্ট্রাকশন হাজার কোটি টাকা দুর্নীতি করে। দুর্নীতির অভিযোগে আওয়ামী লীগের নতুন সরকার তাকে গ্রেপ্তার করতে পারে। আর গ্রেপ্তার ঠেকাতে তিনি ভারতে গিয়েছিলেন!'

>>>>>>>> Amazing India. It can even stop arrest in a foreign country!

I think we should not underestimate India anymore and be respectful of India. America is known for abandoning allies but India is true to her followers.

Thank you India....

Peace!

[ P S - You should read this post with some sense of humor. If you don't, please do not read it ]

-----Original Message-----
From: Jamal G. Khan <M.JamalGhaus@gmail.com>
To: mukto-mona <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Mon, Feb 24, 2014 7:54 pm
Subject: [mukto-mona] ভারতকে দেয়�


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****************************************************
Mukto Mona plans for a Grand Darwin Day Celebration: 
Call For Articles:

http://mukto-mona.com/wordpress/?p=68

http://mukto-mona.com/banga_blog/?p=585

****************************************************

VISIT MUKTO-MONA WEB-SITE : http://www.mukto-mona.com/

****************************************************

"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it".
               -Beatrice Hall [pseudonym: S.G. Tallentyre], 190




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[mukto-mona] ড. ইউনূস, যুক্তরাষ্ট্রের মাখামাখি শেষ!




ড. ইউনূস, যুক্তরাষ্ট্রের মাখামাখি শেষ!

২৭ ফেব্রুয়ারি, ২০১৪ no comments 123 বার পঠিত
priyodesh.net dr.mohammed yunus.

নোবেলজয়ী অধ্যাপক ড. মুহাম্মদ ইউনূসের যুক্তরাষ্ট্রে ক্ষমতাসীন কয়েকজনের সঙ্গে ব্যক্তিগত সম্পর্ক আছে। তাকে গ্রামীণ ব্যাংকের পদ থেকে আওয়ামী লীগের নেতৃত্বাধীন মহাজোট সরকারের 'অন্যায়ভাবে সরিয়ে' দেয়ার বিষয়টি তাই মেনে নিতে পারেননি তারা। প্রকাশ্যেই তারা যুক্তরাষ্ট্রের সরকারের হয়ে ড. ইউনূসের পক্ষ নেন। মহাজোট সরকারকে দেশে, বিদেশে নানাভাবে 'বেকায়দায়' ফেলে যুক্তরাষ্ট্র।

গত ৫ জানুয়ারির 'একতরফা' দশম জাতীয় সংসদ নির্বাচনের পর শীঘ্রই আরেকটি জাতীয় নির্বাচনের জন্য সরকারকে চাপ দিতে আর্ন্তজাতিক সম্প্রদায়কে অনুরোধ জানান ড. ইউনূস। আগামী মে, জুন মাসে নতুন নির্বাচন দিতে তিনি যুক্তরাষ্ট্রের কাছে দাবি জানান। এ দাবিতে তিনি সাড়াও পান।

যুক্তরাষ্ট্র ড. ইউনূসের দাবিতে সমর্থন জানিয়ে ঢাকায় নিযুক্ত বিভিন্ন রাষ্ট্রের রাষ্ট্রদূতদের সঙ্গে শলাপরামর্শ করে। মে, জুনে নির্বাচন দেয়ার জন্য এর মধ্যে ঢাকায় নিযুক্ত প্রায় ৫০টি দেশের রাষ্ট্রদূত, প্রতিনিধি সরকারকে গত ১৬ জানুয়ারি প্রস্তাবও দেন।

এসবই হচ্ছে পুরনো খবর। নতুন খবর হচ্ছে, ড. ইউনূসের সঙ্গে যুক্তরাষ্ট্রের 'মাখামাখি' আপাতত শেষ! তাকে কেন্দ্র করে বাংলাদেশের প্রতি যে কঠোর অবস্থানে ছিল মার্কিন যুক্তরাষ্ট্র, সেখান থেকে দেশটি অনেকটা সরে এসেছে। দেশটি এখন বাংলাদেশের সঙ্গে সম্পর্ককে আবার নতুন করে দেখার চেষ্টা করছে। কারো সঙ্গে ব্যক্তিগত সম্পর্কের বদলে নিজেদের স্বার্থের বিষয়গুলো বড় করে দেখছে দেশটি।

সুর নরম করে যুক্তরাষ্ট্র বলছে, বাংলাদেশের সঙ্গে অর্থনৈতিক সম্পর্ক আরো বাড়াতে হবে। আওয়ামী লীগ সম্পর্কে বিরূপ মনোভাব প্রত্যাহার করারও প্রয়োজন রয়েছে বলে মনে করছে বিশ্ব রাজনীতিতে মোড়ল এ দেশ। মার্কিন পররাষ্ট্র দফতরের দক্ষিণ, মধ্য এশিয়া বিভাগের সহসচিব নিশা দেশাই বিসওয়াল মার্কিন সিনেটের একটি বৈঠকে সম্প্রতি এসব কথাই বলেছেন।

ঢাকাস্থ যুক্তরাষ্ট্রের দূতাবাস সূত্র প্রিয় দেশ ডটনেটকে জানায়, 'ড. ইউনূসের সঙ্গে আওয়ামী লীগের সরকারের আচরণকে যুক্তরাষ্ট্র সমর্থন করে না। তবে এ ইস্যুতে সরকারের সঙ্গে যুক্তরাষ্ট্রের কূটনৈতিক সম্পর্ক খারাপ থাকবে, এটা আপাতত ওবামা প্রশাসন চাচ্ছে না। তারা বিচার করছেন নিজের অর্থনৈতিক স্বার্থ। কারো সঙ্গে ব্যক্তিগত সম্পর্ক টিকিয়ে রাখতে গিয়ে অর্থনৈতিকভাবে ক্ষতিগ্রস্থ হওয়ার নীতিতে যুক্তরাষ্ট্র কখনোই বিশ্বাস করেনি।'

দূতাবাসের আরেকটি সূত্র প্রিয় দেশ ডটনেটকে জানায়, 'ড. ইউনূসকে যুক্তরাষ্ট্রের পক্ষ থেকে বলে দেয়া হয়েছে, গ্রামীণ ব্যাংক ইস্যুতে অপেক্ষা করতে। তার জন্য সরকারকে যুক্তরাষ্ট্র নতুন করে আপাতত আর চাপ দেবে না।'

ড. ইউনূসের ঘনিষ্ঠ সূত্র জানায়, 'যুক্তরাষ্ট্রের সঙ্গে সম্পর্কের অবনতিতে ইউনূস বেশ বিষন্ন হয়ে পড়েছেন। তিনি বিশেষ করে উদ্বিগ্ন তার গড়া প্রতিষ্ঠান গ্রামীণ ব্যাংক নিয়ে। যুক্তরাষ্ট্র সমর্থন না দিলে নিজের প্রতিষ্ঠানের দায়িত্বেও তাকে সরকার থাকতে দেবে না বলে তিনি আশঙ্কা করছেন।'

কূটনৈতিক সূত্রের বরাত দিয়ে গতকাল বুধবার ভারতের প্রভাবশালী গণমাধ্যম দৈনিক আনন্দবাজার পত্রিকা একটি প্রতিবেদন প্রকাশ করে। বাংলাদেশে নিযুক্ত ভারতের সাবেক রাষ্ট্রদূত রজিত মিত্তাল আন্দবাজার পত্রিকাকে এ বিষয়ে বলেন, 'ড. ইউনূসের সঙ্গে শেখ হাসিনার সম্পর্ক খারাপ হওয়াটা অবশ্যই আমেরিকাকে খুশি করেনি। কিন্তু আজকের দিনে সব দেশই নিজের অর্থনৈতিক স্বার্থকে অগ্রাধিকার দেয়, আমেরিকাও।'

বাংলাদেশের প্রতি মার্কিন নীতি হঠাৎ করে নরম হওয়া সম্পর্কে আনন্দবাজার পত্রিকার প্রতিবেদনে বলা হয়, 'মার্কিন নীতি কিছুটা নরম হওয়ার পেছনে একাধিক কারণ রয়েছে। প্রথমত, তাদের জাতীয় নির্বাচনে ভোটদানের হার ৪০.৪ শতাংশ। আমেরিকা বা ইউরোপের বেশিরভাগ দেশে ৫০ শতাংশ ভোট পড়লে তাকে গণতন্ত্রের সর্বোচ্চ সাফল্য বলে মনে করা হয়। ফলে বাংলাদেশের সদ্যসমাপ্ত নির্বাচনকে কিছুতেই ব্যর্থ বলতে পারছে না পশ্চিম বিশ্ব। ঢাকায় অবস্থিত মার্কিন দুতাবাস আরো যে একটি রিপোর্ট হোয়াইট হাউসকে পাঠিয়েছে, তাতে আপাতভাবে সন্তুষ্ট ওবামা প্রশাসন।'

প্রতিবেদনটিতে বলা হয়, 'তবে কয়েক মাস আগেও পরিস্থিতিটা ভিন্ন ছিল। বিএনপি, জামায়াতের জোটের দাবি অগ্রাহ্য করে, প্রধানমন্ত্রী পদ থেকে সরে না দাঁড়িয়েই নির্বাচন করার সিদ্ধান্ত নিয়েছিলেন শেখ হাসিনা। গোটা ঘটনার জেরে হিংসা তুঙ্গে ওঠে। তখনই প্রকাশ্যে বিবৃতি দিয়ে হাসিনার অবস্থানের তীব্র সমালোচনা করে আমেরিকা, ইউরোপিয় ইউনিয়ন। সে সময়ে পশ্চিমের সঙ্গে ধারাবাহিকভাবে কূটনৈতিক দৌত্য চালিয়ে যায় নয়াদিল্লি। মার্কিন নেতৃত্বকে নয়াদিল্লি স্পষ্ট ভাষায় জানায়, দক্ষিণ এশিয়ার নিরাপত্তার স্বার্থে পশ্চিম বিশ্বের উচিত বাংলাদেশে গণতান্ত্রিক, হিংসামুক্ত পরিবেশ ফিরিয়ে আনতে সহায়তা করা।'

মাহিন খান, ঢাকা।



On Sat, Feb 26, 2011 at 10:51 AM, AbdurRahim Azad <arahim.azad@gmail.com> wrote:
If "microfinance" is such viable concept, how come Dr.Yunus was not given Nobel Prize
in Economics .... ? 
 
 "Microfinance" is just "Reaganomics" in a homeopathic package !!!!!
 
Dr.Yunus has been given Nobel Peace Prize not without embedded political objectives....
[Note:
Other Nobel Prizes are Sweden based, while Nobel Peace Prize is awarded by a Norweigian committee based in Oslo, Norway.
 Alas! Alfred P. Nobel's worst dream that peace prize may be used for political purposes .... has come true !!!]
 
 
 
2009 Nobel Peace Prize was given to US President Barack H. Obama (Alas, Hilary !!!!) .
Just tell us on what basis, then just elected US President was given the Prize .....
 
Last year's prize was given to Liu Xiaobo (China) , definitely not without political purposes
serving the West.
 
Of course, Dr.Muhammad Yunus with his Peace Prize, can now be bracketed with Liu Xiaobo (2010), Shirin Ebadi (2003), Israel's Shimon Peres, Yitzhak Rabin (1994) ,
Poland's Lech Walesa (1983), Israel's Menachem Begin (1978),  Henry A. Kissinger (1973) et el ......
 
There were quite a few goot reasons that President Clinton has to work hard "to see Dr.Yunus gets this award....."  [Basically, the award was for political reason and President Clinton had to lobby for it...]
 
No wonder, the super powers are with him !!!!!
No wonder "Dr. Yunus is a world icon " !!!!
What a complacence !!!!!
...
 
ড. ইউনূস বাংলাদেশের সব চেয়ে বিপজ্জনক সাম্রাজ্যবাদী এজেন্ট: বদরুদ্দীন উমর
 
ড. ইউনূস বাংলাদেশের সব চেয়ে ...
19 ফেব 2011 ... প্রখ্যাত রাজনীতিক ও লেখক বদরুদ্দীন উমরের
লেখা ডক্টর ইউনূসের দারিদ্র্য বাণিজ্য
শিরোনামের বইটি বাংলা একাডেমীর তথ্যকেন্দ্রে
জমা না নিয়ে একে অশ্লীল-কুরুচিপূর্ণ ...

 
Sent by
A. Rahim Azad
PS:
 
 

 
On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 11:04 PM, Roxana Huda <rukhsana100@hotmail.com> wrote:
 

Dr. Yunus is a world icon and deserving of the cause and nobel prize. Every idea including microfinance is not free of side effects, but the intentions are pure. Some micro lenders are becoming loan sharks and are taking advantage of this program, which is not inline with Yunus's intentions.  We should look into ways to improve the process so this does not happen, but we should not be blaming Yunus. 
 
Although this vendetta is going on; the super powers are with him.
 
Part of conversation between Hillary and Hasina (Feb 2, 2011)
Secretary: "Madame Prime Minister, let me come to the core point for which I called you. As you have seen even Washington Post picked up your treatment to Dr.Yunus and Grameen Bank. I thought it is about time to tell you how upset we are in Washington DC. I am personally upset because Dr.Yunus has been a family friend to the Clintons long before his wining of Nobel Prize. President Clinton is equally upset. Hope you are aware how hard he worked to see Dr.Yunus gets this award. I know people may have personal issues, but when it comes to national icon like Dr.Yunus, I thought Bangladesh shouldn�t demonize country�s only Nobel Laureate."
Link: http://www.banglaeye.com/news/index.php?s=3&news_id=1095
 
Hillary Rodham Clinton, US Secretary of State in a speech on
July 13, 2009
Link: http://www.usaid.gov/press/speeches/2009/sp090713.html

 
Bengalis have many positive talents, but one dangerous negative talent - which is to bring down any successful and talented person due to personal reasons.
 
 
Regards
Roxana Huda
Grameenphone


To: alapon@yahoogroups.com
From: Oline2@cox.net
Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2011 18:41:17 -0500
Subject: [Alapon] Prof Yunus under attack


 
 
Prof Yunus under attack  
 
The time passes fast enough without my pretending that another decade has gone. It is indeed true that, I met Professor Yunus many times. Last in an elevator in Washington DC. I have exchanged few word  and found  no difference  when I met him some 35 years ago except wrinkles and grey hair.
 
Today, Our Political think-tank are orchestrating to tarnish Prof Yunus's reputation in the world that  basically bringing down Bangladesh's global image. Our Prime minister must  try to understand that the consequences of  "every action there has to have a reaction". Understanding this simple Newton's theory, Prime Minister Sheikh Hasina must stop her personal vendetta against Prof Yunus, and try to understand why she never heard a single negative of ;
 

Rabindranath Tagore

Sir Chandrasekhara Venkata Raman

Amartya Sen

Dr.Rajendra Pachauri

Subrahmanyan Chandrasekhar

Venkatraman 'Venki' Ramakrishnan

V.S. Naipaul

 
Because they are India's national pride.  Now, without my pretending;  if we continue to tarnish Prof Yunus, our nation will face the gloomy moment even when Prime Minister herself  persuing Noble Prize.
 
 
Thank you
Dilawar Hossain
Washington DC
 


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Re: [mukto-mona] Re: context needed to understnad life of prophet Muhammad PBUH



I mean he was born of a Hindu family. Probably he became an atheist at an old age. In the weddings of his son and daughter he followed the Hindu rituals. 

Remember Sunil Ganguly created controversy by saying that on his young life the goddess Saraswati used to provoke sex in him? He was sued by a retired Hindu police officer. He was criticized heavily  by many atheists, liberals, and believers.

Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 27, 2014, at 8:01 PM, Kamal Das <kamalctgu@gmail.com> wrote:

 

When one stresses upon the need to understand the context, he forgets that it imposes the limits of non-universality upon the person being discussed curtailing the limit of his prophethood.  With such followers, who needs non-believers?


On Thursday, February 27, 2014, Sukhamaya Bain <subain1@yahoo.com> wrote:
 

How can the man be a Hindu and an atheist at the same time, Professor Chakrabarty? You probably did not mean it that way.
 
On a more serious note, I think Dr. Roy's question of "what's the meaning of "crude bashing"" needs to be addressed, discussed and debated.
 
To me, an example of "crude bashing" of religion would be drawing a so-called prophet/avatar/god in a disrespectful manner, such as pig face or sexually explicit. It would serve only to provoke the believer, with no attempt to educate, and I would condemn it.
 
However, calling an unjust/hateful/barbaric religious teaching unjust/hateful/barbaric is not what I would call "crude bashing", although personally I would avoid doing the criticism. That is primarily because I do realize that people were less educated and less civilized when those teachings came about. There is no point in criticizing, or in trying to find the context for respecting, the ignorance/mistakes of our forefathers (the foremothers had very little power). The point really is not to follow (and not allowing to follow) any unjust/hateful/barbaric teachings, irrespective of what religion/tradition had that.
 
Sukhamaya Bain
 
=========================================
On Wednesday, February 26, 2014 6:48 PM, Subimal Chakrabarty <subimal@yahoo.com> wrote:
 
I have a very close friend. He is Hindu. He was a professor of a renowned university of Bangladesh. Now he lives in a America. He is an atheist. Some of the comments he makes in Facebook are nothing but crude bashing of Hindu religion. I had an opportunity to read one of his ugly comments about goddess Kali in Facebook. This is called crude bashing. This does not help us. 
Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 25, 2014, at 8:03 PM, Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com> wrote:

 

Subimal Chakraborty Said: "I agree with Farida apa: crude bashing of Islam and for that matter any religion is indefensible. It is not only childish, it also provokes a fanatic and leaves in their hands 'weapons' to make an attempt to stop the progress of human thoughts and ideas. Therefore, critiquing of a religion should be objective and analytical with no preconceived hatred for it in the critic's mind." 
 
Who hates who? I do not think anybody here hates anybody personally; people just put forward opinions. The above statement means some people have hatred against some other people in this forum. This is a misguided notion.
 
Now - what's the meaning of "crude bashing?" All we have heard so far from Ms. Majid and Mr. Rahman are terms like - "Islam bashing" and "hatred for Islam," when they run out of arguments to counter criticism. To them, every criticism of their religion is out of hatred for their religion. Now, an atheist is joining that cohort; this smells like a political stand, not ideological.
 
The fact is – criticism of one's favorite object will always hurt his/her feeling; it does not matter how objective or analytical  criticism may be. Also, how can someone defend a blind faith with a sound logic? They can't. Blind faith logic will always sound ridiculous to an open minded person. Mr. Rahman thinks that he knows the authentic version of Islam. Isn't it a ridiculous claims also? How could anyone be so sure that he/she has the most authentic version of religion, unless it's his faith.

Lately, I am hearing from Mr. Rahman that judging Prophet needs proper context. To me,
a noble man is always a noble man; no context or excuse is needed to evaluate a noble man.
 
Jiten Roy


On Tuesday, February 25, 2014 7:33 PM, Shah Deeldar <shahdeeldar@yahoo.com> wrote:
 
Yes, you are so right about the collapse of the Persian empire. That removed the best wall that was ever built in the western frontier in that era. Had that been intact, we would have been saved from this abysmal mediocrity.
-SD

 
"I speak for the trees, for the trees have no tongues."
-Seuss



On Sunday, February 23, 2014 7:05 PM, Kamal Das <kamalctgu@gmail.com> wrote:
 
Nothing is more blasphemous and moronic to think that a passionate and almighty God sent his best and last messenger to a community of desert oasis and forgot about his best creation since then.  Even a blind could see that the last messenger was a failure till he adopted dacoits, blunder and mayhem of the weak Jewish communities from the hideout of Yatrib.   It was the collapse of the Persian Empire due to war of succession that made Islam the winner.  But again, the Ummayads, the archenemy of the Hashemites in which the Prophet belonged, was the winner.  As Ms. Majid is a closet fundamentalist, she gets irritated by a correct analysis of Islamic history. 

Sent from my iPad

On Feb 19, 2014, at 6:32 AM, Shah Deeldar <shahdeeldar@yahoo.com> wrote:

 
Maybe, we all should hide in a cave because the vicious mob will be angry and start killing innocents? Is that the thinking? A white flag with out a fight? We should only talk about flowers? Right?
-SD

 
"I speak for the trees, for the trees have no tongues."
-Seuss



On Tuesday, February 18, 2014 7:04 PM, Farida Majid <farida_majid@hotmail.com> wrote:
Your imbecile mind will not comprehend the seriousness of the political situation with the vicious Jehadists in Bangladesh -- innocent people will eventually be the victims.
 But you and the troll don't care a hoot . . .
Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2014 15:48:38 -0800
From: shahdeeldar@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Re: context needed to understnad life of prophet Muhammad PBUH
To: farida_majid@hotmail.com; mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com; bangladesh-progressives@googlegroups.com

If brother Shalom wants people to know the prophet and a religion better, then people have no choice but to ask some tough questions. If you do not like the heat, stay out it and be in peace. But ordering how a discussion should be moved forward is not really a Muktomona motto. You got your pet subjects and you are totally free to push forward whatever you think right for your taste. Please stop browbeating others in regards to what should be discussed and what not. That is called censorship. If I remember correct, we were equally critical about the authentic Marxism of Sankar-da when he tried to feed us with a different cool-aid.
-SD

 
"I speak for the trees, for the trees have no tongues."
-Seuss



On Tuesday, February 18, 2014 6:00 PM, Farida Majid <farida_majid@hotmail.com> wrote:
Please STOP posting this religious stuff in mukto-mona.  We've had this crude Islam-bashing type of writings day after day, month after month, year after year.

From: subain1@yahoo.com
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2014 07:16:21 -0800
Subject: [mukto-mona] Re: context needed to understnad life of prophet Muhammad PBUH

 

The talk of 'context needed to understand Mohammad' is essentially nonsense talk.

There is no need to understand a man who lived on Earth some fifteen hundred years back. What the world needs to do is to see the actions of people today, and reward, stay indifferent or punish those actions, depending on the virtue, innocence and criminality, respectively, of those actions. Mohammad does not need any such reward, indifference or punishment.

The problem with the soft-sellers of the Islamic doctrine is that they w


__._,_.___


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[mukto-mona] Pope Benedict Accused In Murder of Children



Pope Benedict/Joeseph Ratzinger has been accused by multiple witnesses of a criminal past that involves the murder and sacrifce of children. Multiple witness testimonies are posted here.  http://revelation12.ca/testimonies-human-sacrifice/



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__,_._,___

Re: [mukto-mona] Re: context needed to understnad life of prophet Muhammad PBUH



Correction please! Peace,right should be peace right.  Monotheistic Abrahamic religions had very little tolerance towards others.

On Thursday, February 27, 2014, Kamal Das <kamalctgu@gmail.com> wrote:

Even Christianity, which preached peace right from the beginning, had decimated Red Indians in the New World called America, blacks in Africa, and aboriginals in Australia.  Only Indians were too vast in number to be made into a demographic minority.  The followers of Islam, on the other hand, not just chanted death to others.  They decimated the Persians, Mesopotamians, and Iberians in the ancient time and Armenians in the last century.  According to the noted American Historian, Will Durant, Muslim rulers in India killed eighty millions of indigenous Indians.  In a democratic India, those who need Muslim vote prefer to forget atrocities.  In South Asia, Hindus think that they are all Aryans which they are not, Muslims think that they are mostly of Arabian descent, even the brown skinned Christians think that they are of European descent!

Sent from my iPad

On Feb 27, 2014, at 5:47 AM, Shah Deeldar <shahdeeldar@yahoo.com> wrote:

 

Maybe one should start pointing out what is crude and what is not. Yes, line by line with the original quotes and see where that perfect political correctness leads us to? People, who have been chanting death to everything for centuries becoming suddenly civil and benevolent? I would not hold not my breath for such grand dream. Would anybody?
-SD
 
"I speak for the trees, for the trees have no tongues."
-Seuss



On Tuesday, February 25, 2014 9:03 PM, Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com> wrote:
 

Subimal Chakraborty Said: “I agree with Farida apa: crude bashing of Islam and for that matter any religion is indefensible. It is not only childish, it also provokes a fanatic and leaves in their hands 'weapons' to make an attempt to stop the progress of human thoughts and ideas. Therefore, critiquing of a religion should be objective and analytical with no preconceived hatred for it in the critic's mind.” 
 
Who hates who? I do not think anybody here hates anybody personally; people just put forward opinions. The above statement means some people have hatred against some other people in this forum. This is a misguided notion.
 
Now - what's the meaning of “crude bashing?” All we have heard so far from Ms. Majid and Mr. Rahman are terms like - “Islam bashing” and “hatred for Islam," when they run out of arguments to counter criticism. To them, every criticism of their religion is out of hatred for their religion. Now, an atheist is joining that cohort; this smells like a political stand, not ideological.
 
The fact is – criticism of one's favorite object will always hurt his/her feeling; it does not matter how objective or analytical  criticism may be. Also, how can someone defend a blind faith with a sound logic? They can't. Blind faith logic will always sound ridiculous to an open minded person. Mr. Rahman thinks that he knows the authentic version of Islam. Isn't it a ridiculous claims also? How could anyone be so sure that he/she has the most authentic version of religion, unless it's his faith.

Lately, I am hearing from Mr. Rahman that judging Prophet needs proper context. To me,


__._,_.___


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Mukto Mona plans for a Grand Darwin Day Celebration: 
Call For Articles:

http://mukto-mona.com/wordpress/?p=68

http://mukto-mona.com/banga_blog/?p=585

****************************************************

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"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it".
               -Beatrice Hall [pseudonym: S.G. Tallentyre], 190





__,_._,___

Re: [mukto-mona] Re: context needed to understnad life of prophet Muhammad PBUH



When one stresses upon the need to understand the context, he forgets that it imposes the limits of non-universality upon the person being discussed curtailing the limit of his prophethood.  With such followers, who needs non-believers?


On Thursday, February 27, 2014, Sukhamaya Bain <subain1@yahoo.com> wrote:
 

How can the man be a Hindu and an atheist at the same time, Professor Chakrabarty? You probably did not mean it that way.
 
On a more serious note, I think Dr. Roy's question of "what's the meaning of "crude bashing"" needs to be addressed, discussed and debated.
 
To me, an example of "crude bashing" of religion would be drawing a so-called prophet/avatar/god in a disrespectful manner, such as pig face or sexually explicit. It would serve only to provoke the believer, with no attempt to educate, and I would condemn it.
 
However, calling an unjust/hateful/barbaric religious teaching unjust/hateful/barbaric is not what I would call "crude bashing", although personally I would avoid doing the criticism. That is primarily because I do realize that people were less educated and less civilized when those teachings came about. There is no point in criticizing, or in trying to find the context for respecting, the ignorance/mistakes of our forefathers (the foremothers had very little power). The point really is not to follow (and not allowing to follow) any unjust/hateful/barbaric teachings, irrespective of what religion/tradition had that.
 
Sukhamaya Bain
 
=========================================
On Wednesday, February 26, 2014 6:48 PM, Subimal Chakrabarty <subimal@yahoo.com> wrote:
 
I have a very close friend. He is Hindu. He was a professor of a renowned university of Bangladesh. Now he lives in a America. He is an atheist. Some of the comments he makes in Facebook are nothing but crude bashing of Hindu religion. I had an opportunity to read one of his ugly comments about goddess Kali in Facebook. This is called crude bashing. This does not help us. 
Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 25, 2014, at 8:03 PM, Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com> wrote:

 

Subimal Chakraborty Said: “I agree with Farida apa: crude bashing of Islam and for that matter any religion is indefensible. It is not only childish, it also provokes a fanatic and leaves in their hands 'weapons' to make an attempt to stop the progress of human thoughts and ideas. Therefore, critiquing of a religion should be objective and analytical with no preconceived hatred for it in the critic's mind.” 
 
Who hates who? I do not think anybody here hates anybody personally; people just put forward opinions. The above statement means some people have hatred against some other people in this forum. This is a misguided notion.
 
Now - what's the meaning of “crude bashing?” All we have heard so far from Ms. Majid and Mr. Rahman are terms like - “Islam bashing” and “hatred for Islam," when they run out of arguments to counter criticism. To them, every criticism of their religion is out of hatred for their religion. Now, an atheist is joining that cohort; this smells like a political stand, not ideological.
 
The fact is – criticism of one's favorite object will always hurt his/her feeling; it does not matter how objective or analytical  criticism may be. Also, how can someone defend a blind faith with a sound logic? They can't. Blind faith logic will always sound ridiculous to an open minded person. Mr. Rahman thinks that he knows the authentic version of Islam. Isn't it a ridiculous claims also? How could anyone be so sure that he/she has the most authentic version of religion, unless it's his faith.

Lately, I am hearing from Mr. Rahman that judging Prophet needs proper context. To me,
a noble man is always a noble man; no context or excuse is needed to evaluate a noble man.
 
Jiten Roy


On Tuesday, February 25, 2014 7:33 PM, Shah Deeldar <shahdeeldar@yahoo.com> wrote:
 
Yes, you are so right about the collapse of the Persian empire. That removed the best wall that was ever built in the western frontier in that era. Had that been intact, we would have been saved from this abysmal mediocrity.
-SD

 
"I speak for the trees, for the trees have no tongues."
-Seuss



On Sunday, February 23, 2014 7:05 PM, Kamal Das <kamalctgu@gmail.com> wrote:
 
Nothing is more blasphemous and moronic to think that a passionate and almighty God sent his best and last messenger to a community of desert oasis and forgot about his best creation since then.  Even a blind could see that the last messenger was a failure till he adopted dacoits, blunder and mayhem of the weak Jewish communities from the hideout of Yatrib.   It was the collapse of the Persian Empire due to war of succession that made Islam the winner.  But again, the Ummayads, the archenemy of the Hashemites in which the Prophet belonged, was the winner.  As Ms. Majid is a closet fundamentalist, she gets irritated by a correct analysis of Islamic history. 

Sent from my iPad

On Feb 19, 2014, at 6:32 AM, Shah Deeldar <shahdeeldar@yahoo.com> wrote:

 
Maybe, we all should hide in a cave because the vicious mob will be angry and start killing innocents? Is that the thinking? A white flag with out a fight? We should only talk about flowers? Right?
-SD

 
"I speak for the trees, for the trees have no tongues."
-Seuss



On Tuesday, February 18, 2014 7:04 PM, Farida Majid <farida_majid@hotmail.com> wrote:
Your imbecile mind will not comprehend the seriousness of the political situation with the vicious Jehadists in Bangladesh -- innocent people will eventually be the victims.
 But you and the troll don't care a hoot . . .
Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2014 15:48:38 -0800
From: shahdeeldar@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Re: context needed to understnad life of prophet Muhammad PBUH
To: farida_majid@hotmail.com; mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com; bangladesh-progressives@googlegroups.com

If brother Shalom wants people to know the prophet and a religion better, then people have no choice but to ask some tough questions. If you do not like the heat, stay out it and be in peace. But ordering how a discussion should be moved forward is not really a Muktomona motto. You got your pet subjects and you are totally free to push forward whatever you think right for your taste. Please stop browbeating others in regards to what should be discussed and what not. That is called censorship. If I remember correct, we were equally critical about the authentic Marxism of Sankar-da when he tried to feed us with a different cool-aid.
-SD

 
"I speak for the trees, for the trees have no tongues."
-Seuss



On Tuesday, February 18, 2014 6:00 PM, Farida Majid <farida_majid@hotmail.com> wrote:
Please STOP posting this religious stuff in mukto-mona.  We've had this crude Islam-bashing type of writings day after day, month after month, year after year.

From: subain1@yahoo.com
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2014 07:16:21 -0800
Subject: [mukto-mona] Re: context needed to understnad life of prophet Muhammad PBUH

 

The talk of 'context needed to understand Mohammad' is essentially nonsense talk.

There is no need to understand a man who lived on Earth some fifteen hundred years back. What the world needs to do is to see the actions of people today, and reward, stay indifferent or punish those actions, depending on the virtue, innocence and criminality, respectively, of those actions. Mohammad does not need any such reward, indifference or punishment.

The problem with the soft-sellers of the Islamic doctrine is that they w


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Mukto Mona plans for a Grand Darwin Day Celebration: 
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Re: [mukto-mona] Jews Take Beating, AMAZING Muslim Saves Them



Hasan is a true noble human being; a true human being do not see religious barriers.

Religious people, on the other hand, see people as Muslim, Jew, Christian, Hindu, etc. If Hasan was a religious man, he might not risk his life for such an unholy act of protecting an infidel.

Jiten Roy



On Thursday, February 27, 2014 7:01 PM, Abid Bahar <abid.bahar@gmail.com> wrote:
 

Jews Take Beating, AMAZING Muslim Saves Them

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k47O0bRdSDg




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http://mukto-mona.com/banga_blog/?p=585

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