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Thursday, May 7, 2015

[mukto-mona] Bhakti-Sufi Traditions: Uniting Humanity ISP I May 2015



Bhakti-Sufi Traditions: Uniting Humanity

Ram Puniyani

 

In contemporary times, religions' identity is being used as cover for political agenda. Be it the terrorist violence or the sectarian nationalism in various parts of the World, religion is used to mask the underlying politics. While one was talking of separation of religion and politics many decades earlier, the times have been showing the reverse trends, more so in South Asia. Globally one came across the news that American President sent a chador [a ceremonial sheet of cloth] to the annual observation at the shrine of Khwaja Moinuddin Chishti at Ajmer. (April 2015). Later one also read (April 22, 2015) that Sonia Gandhi, Atal Bihari Vajpeyi, and Narendra Modi has also offered chadors at the shrine. 

Keeping the relation between state, politics and religion apart, it is interesting that some traditions within religion have appeals cutting across the religious boundaries. The Sufi and Bhakti tradition in Pakistan-India, South Asia are two such humane trends from within Islam and Hinduism respectively, which harp more on unity of humanity as a whole overcoming the sectarian divides. The saints from these traditions had appeal amongst people of different religions and they were away from the centers of power, unlike the clergy which was close ally of the rulers in medieval times. We have seen rich traditions of people like Kabir, Tukaram, Narsi Mehta, Shankar Dev, Lal Dedh, clearly from within Hindu tradition, while Nizamuddin Auliya, Moinuddin Chishti, Tajuddin Baba Auliya, Ajan Pir, Nooruddin Noorani (also known as Nund Rishi) coming from a clear Islamic Sufi tradition and Satya Pir, Ramdev Baba Pir, having a mixed lineage where Bhakti and Sufi themselves are deeply intertwined.

Sant Guru Nanak did try a conscious mixing of the two major religions of India, Hinduism and Islam. He traveled up to Mecca to learn the wisdom of Islam and went to Kashi to unravel the spiritual moral aspects of Hinduism. His first follower was Mardan and Miyan Mir was the one who was respectfully invited to lay the foundations of Golden Temple; the holy Sikh Shrine. The Guru Granth Sahib has an inclusive approach to religious wisdom and it takes the verses from Koran, couplets from Kabir and other Bhakti saints. No wonder people used to say of him 'Baba Nanak Sant Fakir, Hindu ka Guru Musalman ka Pir' (Saint Nanak is sant for Hindus and pir for Muslims)

In today's scenario the global discussion has been centered round religion due to its use in political sphere. Now the renewed interest in Sufi tradition at one level is heartening. Sufism has been prominent in South Asia from last ten centuries. Word Sufi means coarse wool fabric, the type of clothes which were worn by Sufi mystics. It grew within Shiaism but over time some Sunnis also took to this sect.  It has strong streaks of mysticism and gave no importance to rituals and tried to have understanding of God by transcending the anthropomorphic understanding of Allah, looking at him more as a spiritual authority.  This is so similar to the belief held by Bhakti saints also. Many Sufi's had pantheistic beliefs and they articulated their values in very humane way.

In the beginning the orthodox sects started persecuting them but later compromises were struck. The Sufis formed the orders of roving monks, dervishes. People of all religions in many countries frequent their shrines, this again is like Bhakti saints, who have following amongst people of different religions.

On parallel lines Bhakti is probably the most outstanding example of the subaltern trend in Indian religious history. The Bhakti saints came from different streams of society, particularly from low caste. Bhakti opposed the institutionalization of religion, tried to decentralize it, and declared that religion is a private matter. It gave respectability to the separation of state power and religion and merged the concept of God worship with the process of getting knowledge. Travails of poor people are the focus of bhakti saints' work. Bhakti traditions gave respectability to many low castes. This tradition had inclusive approach towards Muslims as well. This tradition posed a challenge to upper caste hegemony.

Bhakti tradition opposed the rituals, hegemony of elite of society. They adopted the languages more popular with the masses. Also they talked of one God. In India in particular Hindu Muslim unity has been one of the concerns expressed by many of the saints from this tradition.

What one needs to realize is that there are various tendencies with every religion. The humane one's as represented by Bhakti and Sufi are the ones' which united Humanity and harped on morality-spirituality of religions. The intolerant tendencies have been usurped by political forces for their political agenda. In sub continent during the freedom movement the declining sections of society, Rajas, Nawabs, Land lords came up with Muslim and Hindu Communalism to begin with. This nationalism in the name of religion had nothing to do with morality of religions. It was use of religion's identity for political goals.  In the national movements we had people like Gandhi, Maulana Abul Kalam Azad who were religious but opposed to religious nationalism.

The essence of Sufi and Bhakti tradition are reminders to us that spirituality, morality part of the religion has been undermined in the current times. The inclusive-humane nature of these traditions needs to be upheld and the divisive-exclusionary versions of religions have to be ignored for better future of humanity. 

 



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Posted by: ram puniyani <ram.puniyani@gmail.com>


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Re: [mukto-mona] Enjoy



 
The system we see in the West is the natural caste-system, known as class-system. This was the essence of the original caste-system in India, before it morphed into inheritance.  
Jiten Roy

 

From: "Shah Deeldar shahdeeldar@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, May 7, 2015 8:15 PM
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Enjoy

 
In our modern society, we may not have a caste system per se but we do have more or less a very similar system that is also labor and intelligence based. Only difference is that it is no longer an inherited one. It is rather power, money and education that makes certain people belonging to the higher caste. We can take any society and you can see who belongs to what class. US is a perfect example!
Hindus were blunt, others are little less blunt. That is the difference. But, it is the same damn old wine...... only packaged in a new bottle.
 




On Thursday, May 7, 2015 7:01 PM, "Jiten Roy jnrsr53@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 
The caste-system was introduced initially as the division of labor. But, after it was made an inheritance, that system lost all utility, and it turned into a tool for exploitation and oppression.
I agree with you that – the so-called lower caste people should have rejected such unfair (artificial) status in the society. They are, therefore, some extent responsible for allowing their continuous exploitation for generations.
 
I know inheritance-based system was introduced in the society as the destiny, ordained by God. To my surprise, many people still think so in this day and age. Even educated and enlightened people cannot get out of this belief due to their blind faith in religion.

But, I believe, things will change soon, with proper enlightenment and education. They will understand that - caste is not a destiny, and this system is a meaningless entity now, because - inheritance-based system cannot control the division of labor any longer.
Jiten Roy

 

From: "Kamal Das kamalctgu@gmail.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 6, 2015 11:11 PM
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Enjoy

 
Hindu societies from India to Indonesia had plenty of faults. These fell easily to Muslim invasion. So did even the Persians. They fell even more easily. In fact, the four major caste system was a Persian innovation. Modern day theologians don't consider it ineffective. The system decomposed when belonging to high caste became inheritance. 

Alliance among the Dalits and Muslims is a fact of politics in India even today. Jogen Mandal and his followers voted for Pakistan. He was assured a cabinet post in lieu of it. When Indian army marched into Hyderabad, the repercussion set into the form of riot in East Pakistan. Fearing arrest, Mandal left for Calcutta. The poor subaltern Hindus were uprooted due to their bad judgment. Along with blaming the Brahmins, the low caste should also blame themselves for the events. The downtrodden should overthrow the oppressor first and then choose a new destiny.

Sent from my iPad



On May 6, 2015, at 8:53 AM, Sukhamaya Bain subain1@yahoo.com [mukto-mona] <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 
We, gentlemen, let me make some comments here.
 
The Hindu caste system has been no less harmful for the Indian subcontinent than the Hindu-Muslim divide. To compare the extra-religious and far less defined caste mentality among the Muslims with the Hindu caste system is preposterous. Here, I am in serious disagreement with Dr. Roy and Dr. Das. Look, even as recently as in 1947, much of the present day territory of Bangladesh fell into the insanity of Islamic fanaticism because a so-called low-caste Hindu community decided that their Muslim brothers would be better than the so-called high-caste Hindus.
 
Discrimination against women in Hindu religion/tradition has also been an egregious and indefensible offence.
 
I am also puzzled by Mr. Chakrabarty's notion that the preacher in the video was "spreading hatred against women." The preacher asked people to not look at women on Earth lustfully, because that would be a sin; and if they could avoid that sin, they would get the prize of having so many attractive, sexy and lustful young women in heaven. Here he surely did not preach anything like subjugating or harming women. He was just stupid, preaching a bunch of stupider people; and no honorable human being would associate himself/herself with thing kind of morons. We could add/emphasize that this kind of stupid people can be manipulated to do a lot of bad things for their belief, and they should be re-educated - hell with religion, if needed.
 
SuBain
 
=========================================
 



On Tuesday, May 5, 2015 7:43 PM, "Jiten Roy jnrsr53@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 
Exactly, Dr. Das, Islam has various castes, and so do all other religions also. I am not sure how someone, like Mr. Chakraborty, could equate caste-ism to religious communality.
His extra eagerness to expose my favoritism to Hinduism by pointing out my willful omission of Hinduism from the list of organized religions made him persistent on my response. I understood his intention, and ignored his first response. I knew - he did not know what an organized religion was. He insisted on my response again, and I had to reply.  
Jiten Roy

 

From: "Kamal Das kamalctgu@gmail.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, May 4, 2015 9:53 PM
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Enjoy

 
Contrary to common belief, even Islam ain't free from caste system. Al Barani, a contemporary of Muhammad bin Tughlaq defended it. In his time, the number of castes in Islam was a little less than four hundred. Buddhism, Christianity, and Judaism also have it. An ignoramus can put as much mud on himself as he wants. Such an idiot should follow the steps of Suman Kabir.

Sent from my iPad



On May 5, 2015, at 5:57 AM, Jiten Roy jnrsr53@yahoo.com [mukto-mona] <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 
"Dr. Jiten Roy compared casteism and discrimination against women in Hinduism as a mosquito bite while the same thing in other organized religions as tiger bites."
I always regret to reply to idiotic response, like this, because it's a misstatement of my comment.
The format of this forum does not allow me to qualify all comments with enough details that is required for some people to understand.
First, Hinduism is not an organized religion; in fact, it's the most disorganized religion on earth, which recognizes all religions, all interpretations (Mots), and all paths (ways).  
Second, caste-ism is not the religious communality, because - caste-ism occurs within the same religious boundary, and affects communities within the same religion only. On the contrary, religious communality occurs across the religious boundary, and affects all other religious communities.
In fact, caste-ism of Hinduism helped other organized religions (Islam, Christianity, Buddhism, Sikhism, Jainism, etc.) to spread and flourish in India, instead of affecting them negatively.
That why, I compared caste-ism of Hinduism to mosquito-bite, and religious communality with tiger-bite. Also, Mr. Chakraborty, this comment has nothing to do with discrimination of women in religion, which is a different topic altogether.
I think - your thoughts are messed up with too many issues.   
Jiten Roy

 

From: "Subimal Chakrabarty subimal@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, May 3, 2015 7:27 PM
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Enjoy

 
I think both Bangladesh and india have some sort of blasphemy law. He can be prosecuted if the government wants to. Having said this I must say that I do not believe in blasphemy law. 

Moreover, spreading hatred against women in an open forum can be taken seriously by the women's rights groups and the feminists. I claim myself to be belonging to the latter group. So logically I am justified to seek justice. 

In a different but related thread Dr. Jiten Roy compared casteism and discrimination against women in Hinduism as a mosquito bite while the same thing in other organized religions as tiger bites. He did not elaborate on it. It was a single liner. 

Sent from my iPhone



On May 3, 2015, at 1:19 PM, Sukhamaya Bain subain1@yahoo.com [mukto-mona] <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 
If bringing to justice means punishment by a court of law or worse, Professor Chakrabarty's statement would be disappointing; as he is an otherwise rational intellectual. If the speaker committed the so-called blasphemy, even by intentional falsification (which is worse than misinterpretation) of Islam, the punishment for him should be from the proclaimed almighty, Allah, not from humans individually or collectively (society/government). The so-called Ulema and people in general could criticize/disown him, nothing more.
 
SuBain
 
=================================== 



On Sunday, May 3, 2015 1:37 PM, "subimal chakrabarty subimal@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 
If Prof. Majid is right (I am sure she is), the speaker is committing 'blasphemy' by mentioning a Surah which does not exist in the Koran. He should be identified, caught, and brought to justice. The entire Ulema should also protest. 



On Sunday, May 3, 2015 10:31 AM, "Jiten Roy jnrsr53@yahoo.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


 
 
The trouble is - not many people has the ability to interpret the religious scriptures, and they depend on these readily available sources for understanding the religious teachings, which should be a grave concern for the society, in my view.
Unfortunately, there is no accountability of any preacher, and anything can go in the name of religion. Some cunning people are taking advantage of this situation, and they have taken up the religious preaching, as a living, without knowing much about the religion, and they are passing political and personal interests as divine religious doctrines.  This should not be the case.
Since the society revolves around religion, Government must control these individuals through the Religious Affairs' Ministry. Otherwise, society will be polluted beyond repair. We need to remember, religious freedom only gives freedom to practice religion. Unfiltered religious propaganda is not a part of the religious freedom.  
Jiten Roy
    
 

From: "Farida Majid farida_majid@hotmail.com [mukto-mona]" <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com>
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, May 3, 2015 1:28 AM
Subject: RE: [mukto-mona] Enjoy

 
He is LYING in the name of Allah! He has uttered gobbledygook - some Arabic sounding gibberish. It is certainly not any ayah from any Surah of the Qur'an that says what he says it says. There is no Bokhari, no Muslim Hadith that say what he says they say. His audience is fooled and bullied. He should be reported to the Police for purposefully distorting Holy Scriptures in order to incite social unrest.

I have forwarded the video to a member of the Law Commission asking for suggestions to curb such outrageous public bullying.






From: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
To: mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sat, 2 May 2015 13:46:28 -0500
Subject: Re: [mukto-mona] Enjoy

 
Can we get reference? I understand it was in Dhaka, but who is the speaker? Does he belong to an Islamic political party? Has it been recorded by the speaker for public consumption or some one videoed it secretly and then put the same on YouTube? 

Sent from my iPhone

On May 2, 2015, at 9:05 AM, Sitangshu Guha guhasb@gmail.com [mukto-mona] <mukto-mona@yahoogroups.com> wrote:





















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Posted by: Jiten Roy <jnrsr53@yahoo.com>


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Mukto Mona plans for a Grand Darwin Day Celebration: 
Call For Articles:

http://mukto-mona.com/wordpress/?p=68

http://mukto-mona.com/banga_blog/?p=585

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VISIT MUKTO-MONA WEB-SITE : http://www.mukto-mona.com/

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"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it".
               -Beatrice Hall [pseudonym: S.G. Tallentyre], 190





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