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Wednesday, June 7, 2017

[mukto-mona] Re: When terrorist are without religion, but keen on Shariat law

Thanks, Zoglul Bhai, for your indepth analysis on Sharia Law and Terrorism. I know my view on Sharia was too simplistic, a layman's point. 

The crux of my comments on "Terrorism" was:

1) The urgent task at hand is to prevent all terrorist acts in which innocent people become victims. In my humble perception, all such acts are un-Islamic, anti-Islamic. Yes, there were and are thousands of other terror acts making millions victims through ages committed by non-Muslims. My idea is to address the ones that bring bad name to my proud faith, Islam. 

2) One is not terrorist by birth, he is made so. If the process of one's becoming a terrorist is studied, analysed and addressed, terrorism will  fade, if not die completely. If we fail to ignore the truth and face the facts, all anti-terror acts will end in failure, as it is happening today. Attributing 9/11 (in which less than 3000 people, that included Muslims, lost their lives) to terrorists, nearly a million innocent lives have been taken in revenge so far; collateral damage is incalculable. The so called "war against terrorism" expanded globally and its end does not seem to be in sight. The loss of lives and destruction in cash and kind in these operations surpassed many times those done by all the great wars the world had faced so far. If we fail to address the root causes of all the so called terror acts, the syndrome and cycle of destruction will continue. We should stop watering the plant while cutting its root.

From: Outlook Team <>
Sent: Wednesday, June 7, 2017 12:09 PM
Cc: Razzak Syed; zainul abedin; qamruddin chowdhury; DeEldar;; Khoniker Othithee; ANISUR RAHMAN; Jalal Uddin Khan; Farida Majid; Mohiuddin Anwar;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;; Outlook Team;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;; bangladesh-progressives googlegroups
Subject: Re: When terrorist are without religion, but keen on Shariat law

From: Zoglul Husain (  

Thank you, Ranu Bhai, for your discussion on Sharia Law and 'Islamic' terrorism. Immediately after the US-Israel false-flag operation of 9/11 2001, Bush declared "Crusade" against the Muslims, and since then a huge number of the lackeys of US imperialism, Israeli expansionism and Indian hegemonism and their supporters have been engaged in campaigns against anything Muslim. They are, and will be, doomed to failure. US-Israel and their allies, since 2001, have destroyed Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria, etc. and have killed more than 5 million people, one of the worst genocides in history. So much for their law, human rights and humanity!  

Briefly, the following are my views on Sharia Law and "Islamic" terrorism: 

Veiws on Sharia Law: "The contemporary legal systems of the world are generally based on one of four basic systems: civil law, common law, statutory law, religious law or combinations of these" (Wiki). Examples of religious law "include Christian canon law, Islamic sharia, Jewish halakha, and Hindu law" (Wiki: Please see:

Demographically, there are about 16% people in the world, who are classed as non-religious, while 84% people of the world adhere to faith. We can see the beginnings of faith and law, including religious law, in ancient Mesopotamia and ancient Egypt. Faiths are very much there today, and laws relating to faiths are there too. The religions, and religious laws, are supported by a huge number of people. 

There are about 70 countries, which use Sharia Law in varying degrees. The US, Canada and the EU all have certain applications of Sharia Law too. In Britain, there were 85 Sharia courts in 2009, the number may have increased by now. The former Arch Bishop of Canterbury, leader of the Church of England, supported the application of Sharia Law in the UK in certain cases, and so did the most senior Judge in England (Please see:  
Veiws on "Islamic" terrorism: In an email, I wrote: "9/11 2001 was a gigantic false-flag operation by Neocon-CIA-Mossad to attack Afghanistan, and the Muslim countries in the Middle East and North Africa, for the purpose of US imperialism for domination and plunder, and Israeli expansionism to create Greater Israel from Euphrates to Nile. After being defeated in the war by grassroots fighters, they created ISIS to fight the Muslims by the Muslims. US and Israel are the top terrorist countries in the world. They created 'Islamic terrorism' and Islamophobia. In their wars and genocides since 2001, 5 million people have been killed, and many more injured and made homeless." 
I circulated in the past a report: "Europol Report: All Terrorists are Muslims…Except the 99.6% that Aren't" (Only a measly 0.4% of terrorist attacks from 2006 to 2008 could be attributed to extremist Muslims (of which many were false-flag), where as 99.6% were by non-Muslims and separatists). I also circulated the US report, "All Terrorists are Muslims…Except the 94% that Aren't" (6% of terrorist attacks on U.S. soil from 1980 to 2005 were carried out by Islamic extremists (many false-flag). The remaining 94% were from other groups (42% from Latinos, 24% from extreme left wing groups, 7% from extremist Jews, 5% from communists, and 16% from all other groups)). Statistics with pie-charts are available, except that false-flag attacks are not mentioned in these reports.   

I also circulated the following article of Sheikh Abu Hamza or Pierre Vogel:  


Sheikh Abu Hamza or Pierre Vogel

Who started the first world war?...Muslims?

Who started the second world war?...Muslims?

Who sent the nuclear bombs of Hiroshima and Nagasaki?...Muslims?

Who killed more than 100 millions of Indians in North America?...Muslims?

Who killed more than 50 millions of Indians in south America?...Muslims?

Who took about 180 millions of African people as slaves and 88% of them died and was thrown in Atlantic ocean? Did Muslims do it?

Who killed about 20 millions of Aborigines in Australia?...Muslims?

Who killed thousands of people in Vietnam?...Muslims?

You ask me...............
this is my answer......

NO! They werent muslims!

Sent: 07 June 2017 00:05
To: Razzak Syed; zainul abedin
Cc: qamruddin chowdhury; DeEldar;; Khoniker Othithee; ANISUR RAHMAN; Jalal Uddin Khan; Farida Majid; Mohiuddin Anwar;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;; bangladesh-progressives googlegroups
Subject: Re: When terrorist are without religion, but keen on Shariat law

We are discussing two issues here: Sharia and Terrorism.


I am not much of a knowledgeable person on Sharia matters, but explanations provided by Brs. Qamaruddin Chowdhury, Zainul Abedin and Razzak Syed are quite logical and acceptable. As a layman, I understand Sharia Law is the Islamic Law that has been enjoined in the Quran and elaborated by Hadiths. It is immaterial at what point of time these laws have been codified or written. The society and environment we live today did not exist during the times of Prophets Adam, Ibrahim or Muhammad's time (PBUT).  

Sharia Law does not, and should not, nullify local laws, state laws and even international laws. Nor do non-Muslims need to follow them, unless in some strict Muslim countries on certain matters such as drinking alcohol or public display of affection. Muslim couples marry the Islamic way while following many local customs and traditions that are not part of Sharia. But that does not make the marriage void. 


The burning question is the growth of terrorism the world over. Unfortunately, the most terrorists today come with Islamic identity, rightly or wrongly. It must  be addressed on an urgent basis, as well as on a long term perspective. Killing innocent people, for whatever objective, has no Islamic sanction; that should be understood accepted by all. 

The immediate steps are to stop such acts by whatever means available and punish the perpetrators according to local law. Rarely, the terrorists work in isolation. They have accomplices, they have parents, families, friends, relatives. It is difficult to comprehend that their planning can go unnoticed. All peace loving people have a responsibility to preempt such suspicious acts, prevent them and finally to report to the authorities. All Muslims, all Islamic countries, all Islamic bodies must condemn such killing of innocents and issue relevant Fatwa against these activities.  

If someone is interested to fight for conviction, whatever it is, he should go to the battlefront and kill his enemies. 

However, it is the long term solution that is more important. It is not difficult to find out why someone becomes a "terrorist." Most so called terror acts can be eliminated if those causes and impediments are suitably addressed and resolved. 

It goes without saying that modern terrorism started after the creation of Israel  that displaced Palestinian Arabs from their land. The West continued to patronize the Jews at the expense of the Arabs. The US provides $4 billion to Israel annually in economic and military assistance, which enabled it to develop one of the most modern and sophisticated military including nuclear arsenal to use against its adversaries.  To the contrary, the Palestinians receive virtually nothing. They are systematically annihilated and pushed to the margins of life. They feel victimized and seek justice. But they have no weapons to fight back the enemy except themselves. So we see the suicide bombers. Mind you, it needs dedication and courage to be a suicide bomber, however weird and illogical the motif be. The menace continue to expand globally. 

9/11 Commission and many other studeis concluded--though not published under questionable pressure--that Arab-Israeli conflict was the root of Twin Tower attack in 2001. This is an ostrich in the sand view where the forest is seen, not the trees. Similarly, all terror acts have roots; that need to be explored and eliminated as far as possible. Otherwise, this cancer will prevail  and continue to spread no matter what counter measure we try to impose and implement.  

Finally, I fully agree with Zainul Bhai that we should maintain decency and decorum in our talks. I believe people in this forum are highly educated and enlightened. It is unbecoming of a such a fine group of people engaging in personal slanders. However, to give a little color to our narratives, we often coat them with slangs (as I often do), which are done in jest only. Br. Gani's humors are very interesting!

From: Razzak Syed <>
Sent: Monday, June 5, 2017 7:56 PM
To: zainul abedin
Cc: qamruddin chowdhury; DeEldar;; Khoniker Othithee; ANISUR RAHMAN; Jalal Uddin Khan; Farida Majid; Mohiuddin Anwar; RANU CHOWDHURY;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;; bangladesh-progressives googlegroups
Subject: Re: When terrorist are without religion, but keen on Shariat law
Dear Br.,
       The word 'Shariah' means 'Law', these people arguing for nothing, specially Mr/Mrs KO, claiming 'Islamic Shariah' established 200 years after the death of Prophet (SAW), which is absolutely wrong, Islamic Law was practiced from the time of Prophet (SAW), there are various chapters in the Quran, Allah (SAW) explained 'code of life', for example, Surah 'Nisa' explains family relations, Surah 'An-Kabut' how to deal in the wars, how deal with enemies after war and so on. 

Due influx of reverting to Islam, Sharia Court was established during the time of Hazrat Omar (RA), which is purely based on Quran and Hadith, if any matters not covered in Quran and Hadith, then the matter should be dealt with discussion between the spiritual leaders. 

Hope it's clears someone's doubts.

Razzak A. Syed

Sent from my iPhone

On 6 Jun 2017, at 5:35 am, zainul abedin <> wrote:

Salam and Ramadan Mubarak, brother,

You have very good/logical arguments.

On principle, I generally do not reply to and/or participate in the postings/arguments of the pseudonyms. Being pseudonymous is not bad and illegal. But some people drape themselves under ugly and wrong issues/arguments, though in some cases they have good arguments too. Some good things cannot recoup ugly things. 

You may leave them alone or argue with them. However, you/we need to avoid name-calling in retorts (such as kauwa---it seems humorous but may not be taken in a nicer way!). It is your wisdom.  

I also tell that Quoran is the last version of Islam, the only religion of Allah/God that started from the first Human and first Prophet Adam (AS) as you said "the Quran, the Last Testament." If we read just Surah Bakara we can find the gist of the issues you argued.

Shariah has had different ways of application according to contexts, place, situation. Shariah was in application from Adam (AS) too as was needed. Shariah/rules were in application during Rasullah (SM). People do not understand that what rules Rasulullah (SM) applied to the society (from family and prayer places to the state) to run the society/state were nothing but Shariah. I see someone always say shariah "were written 200 years after the Prophet SAS!!" His term "written" can be taken as compilation as Hadises (Hadiths) were compiled later. 

Habitats for Muslims, and others too: "Sare Jaaha Hamara." In Sura Bakara we can see "Lillaahi maa fissamaawaati wa maa fil ard....;wallaahu 'alaa kulli shai in qadeer (To Allah belongs all that is in the heavens and all that is on the earth,....And Allah is Able to do all things.). As Allah's servants we can be everywhere. Yes, there are rules of the lands dictated/demarcated by different powers, we have to follow, and we follow. There were/are movements to change rules of the lands too. We are not apart from that, Al-Hamdulillah.

BWT, though it was not your issue. I like to say, we also need to avoid arguments on the use of urine of camels and cows. These are mostly matters of cultures. If Hindus make it a matter of religion let them go with that. But use of camel-urine is not a matter of religion. It was in vogue in the land of Arab and some people still occasionally use that (mostly as medicine and something else).  I talked to a Arab scholar he told me that Rasulullah (SM) did not use that but when some companions (mostly Beduins) asked him he told them they could use that if needed.

Please forgive me if I am wrong in some cases, and you can rectify those.

Khoda Hafez,

Zainul Abedin

On Monday, June 5, 2017 10:25 AM, qamruddin chowdhury <> wrote:

 There is no point in writing to these posts, as their only aim is to spread hatred.  However, they should recognize the following simple truths :

1.  Sharia law is mostly practiced as a private law in Muslims' lives and that's why Muslims and their families are at peace with themselves compared to any other family structure in the world.  It's the absence of Sharia Law in Muslim inhabited countries which is the reason of unrest, mainly due to outdated colonial laws or no laws at all except political muscle power supported by outside interest groups to destabilize for reasons well known, better not said.

2. Why destabilize Muslim inhabited countries?  It's jealousy; because of non-fulfillment of human spiritual attainment from sophistication and material advancements compared to the happiness among poor Muslim societies. Happiness is not counted by possession of materialism, but by contentment which is absent in wealthy countries and people.  The never ending race is for more and more without fulfillment.  Also in the cyclical revolution and devolution of world leadership, it's the Muslims who are in line after the fall of this civilization.  So, the efforts are on to contain this future leadership of Muslims.  As China was tried to be contained; but China is not rising; but China has risen.  Similarly, Islam and Muslim civilization shall rise for the benefit of humanity, whether you accept it not.  And, if you know, today's advancements in science, technology, cosmology, etc., are also due to great contributions made by Muslims scholars in previous centuries.  You may make a research from Google! or from advanced ivy league Universities. I do not keep references.  Whoever needs may do it themselves.

3.  Muslims, Christians, and Jews are the followers of Abrahamic religion.  We are brothers of the same monotheism, although there are misunderstanding among brothers.  We consider all other human beings as brothers/sisters too, all sons/daughters of Adam and Eve.  The Jewish follow the Old Testament (Torah in Arabic), the Christians follow the New Testament (the Injeel in Arabic; or Bible as another name), and Muslims follow the Quran, the Last Testament.  Muslims believe in all the previous revelations God had sent to Moses and Jesus which are extended and completed in Quran, the Last Testament.  I invite all to at least read the meanings (through translations) of the Quran to try, know and understand God's Message to all mankind.  Whoever submits to God's Message and accepts the Messenger becomes a believer, i.e., a Muslim.  You have read tens of thousands of book written by other men, why not read just One book from God, the Last Message, unchanged, untarnished.  It's beneficial to know the Truth and I can assure you, all will benefit and come away from misunderstanding among mankind through wrong interpretations.

3.  KO kauwa (crow) doesn't pray in masjid, doesn't accept Kaaba as a direction of prayer, doesn't accept Quran and Sharia Law as these were written 200 years after the Prophet SAS!!  Let him be what he is.  We are not to judge.  He will be judged by God, and that's sufficient.  It seems he doesn't accept Prophets Ibrahim and Ismael (Peace Be Upon Them) building Kaaba at God's behest, last Prophet (Peace Be Upon Him) changing the direction of prayer from towards Jerusalem Masjid al Aqsa  to towards Kaaba as per revelation in Quran.  Muslims are those who believe and obey God's revelation and His Messengers.  Very few do in all ages (as very neatly pointed out by bro Razzak Sayed in one of his e-mails by quoting verses from the Quran itself).  So, KO and his type may remain where they are; although we feel sad for their misunderstanding or voluntary wrong misinterpretation, but we are least bothered.  These type were there in all ages and will be there until the Day of Judgement.   Just for info though, one should know that Quran existed in its present form during the life time of Prophet (PBUH) as it was recited wholly during the month of Ramadan in the prayers, the Companions of Prophet PBUH also had memorized and written down in its exact form, arch angel Gabriel had recited it twice to Prophet PBUH and vice versa during the months of Ramadan.  However, as Islam didn't spread beyond Arabia during Prophet's PBUH life of 63 years on earth, the Quran was not compiled as a book then until the time of third Caliph Hazrat Usman RA who inspired the companions to write it down so that even non=Arabs could read and memorize.  These are long historical events written and preserved in history which 1.7 billion Muslims believe. So, it's immaterial if KO kauwa (crow) and his like go on making different noises.  Such noises were never successful in the past, nor it will be ever.

4.  Why Muslims are in USA, Europe and other countries, DeElder, KO, and others ask!  Why not?  Is this not God's earth ?  Every one has the same freedom of movement as any other, subject to Governmental regulations.  Don't Indians and Hindus spread all over the world?  Specially, don't five million Indian Hindus work in BD and earn five billion US Dollars to remit to India?   Why not DeElder, KO and similar others go back to India or their own countries?  Who are they to frame USA, Europe or other countries' immigration rules?  Do these countries know less them DeElder, KO kauwa?   

Let's stop this hatred which has started from the time their Goddess Hayena is seated in Govt in BD.  They  will vanish once Hayena type are gone from BD by God's Grace, sooner or later.

From: DeEldar <>
To: "" <>
Cc: Khoniker Othithee <>; Razzak Syed <>; ANISUR RAHMAN <>; Jalal Uddin Khan <>; Farida Majid <>; Mohiuddin Anwar <>; qamruddin chowdhury <>; RANU CHOWDHURY <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; "" <>; bangladesh-progressives googlegroups <>
Sent: Sunday, June 4, 2017 9:54 AM
Subject: Re: When terrorist are without religion, but keen on Shariat law

Most of the terror acts are originating from Muslim community and its avid followers. So, it is disingenuous to claim that terrorists have no religion. They do! And the name of the religion is Islam!  Many Islamist love to hear it to cover their dirty @sses for another day but covertly and overtly, they are part of the big terror network. Justifiably, Islamist should be profiled to put an end to this menace before civil society take up the guns to protect their lives and properties. The secular decency will be thrown out through the window as patience is running very thin. Islamist have already created hell in their own Muslim dominated countries and now, they will be allowed to spread the chaos in the west? I doubt very much. Something got to give here! 

On Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 9:20 AM, Khoniker Othithee <> wrote:
To understand indoctrination this large pool of suicidal terrorists, among closet look of the literature , the place they gather, the prayer, stated goal and how they recruit needs to be looked.

The biggest clue may be in the  stated goal, which is Shariat law. After decades of terrorism, it Is reasonable to think now , establishing Shariat Law is the  lynchpin of indoctrination.

FYI, the Shariat Law was coined 200 years after advent of Islam. For first 200 years they didn't have Shariat ; does that make  them lesser Muslim? Those think Sharia is important are cult, like deciples of maula baba.

Since, Shariat Law is a suspect and not must for Muslim as it was for 200 years , why not ignore it.
Instead of banning Muslim from entering US, Trump should be banned Shariat Law, explaining that for first 200 , they didn't have that law.

These sharitat law fanatics killed children, innocent, destroyed families and countries. Banning the law for at least 10 year may turn the corner. They did with communism, what is the problem.Those who don't like USA for that, can leave USA.


Posted by: RANU CHOWDHURY <>

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