WRT: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mukto-mona/message/48248
It looks entire debate is turning to too many different direction, such as `Does internationalism support patriotism?', `MM's humanity approach', `establishing democracy' etc. which have no relation with the original article posted. I will keep my discussion within the context (i.e, only between science and religion) which was originally proposed by the author for being discussed. I am also focusing on the portion that was targeted towards my previous response on the same thread.
Mr. Gani wrote: "Thank you for your noble mind and enlightening information. I read these with deep interest and shall indeed go through the rest over time."
My response: You are certainly welcome.
Mr. Gani wrote: As you have rightfully mentioned, I was trying to combine philosophy of science and religion together and I still believe that these 2 could easily co-exist.
Response: The coexistence is sometime relies on clever interpretation of ancient thoughts depicted in holy books. I would like to give an example for you. Remember that in sixteenth century Roman Church forced Galileo to disavow any implications from his writings that the Copernican theory of the solar system was a fact of reality. Giordano Bruno burned at the stake as a heretic for supporting Copernicus's view. Why? Because, Bible (and also Quran and other ancient religious books) is quite precise that the earth is the immobile center of the universe: Psalm 103 states, "The Lord God laid the foundation of the earth, and that it not be moved forever. (also see 1Chronicles, 16/30, Psalms 93/1, Psalms 96/10, Psalms 104/5 etc.) ". However, when the supporting evidence became simply too overwhelming and religion's back was held in the wall – they had to adapt or die. Eventually, religion adapted and sanctioned the notion that the earth, in reality, moves about the sun. The `religious scholars' (read `interpreters') had to admit and tell the common people that what is written in the `holy books' cannot always be taken literally. The same clever ploy has been played since ever. The theory of evolution can be a case of interest today. Almost all religionists today are hostile towards it, because it is antithetical to their religious teaching. But as time passes, especially after the door of genetics got opened, the evidence for evolution is simply overwhelming. Former Pope had to admit that evolution was a fact. Now religionists have to change their position and dig out the holy verses to relate with their scripture to `show' their scripture is `really' scientific. I am not sure what you think about such `combination… that easily co-exist', but I personally find obscurantism, dishonesty, intellectual corruption, disingenuous doublethink and sometimes amusement in such attitude in finding `Big bang', `genetics' or `evolution' in those ancient books.
Mr. Gani wrote: I find some of your references inchoate, especially "something" from "nothing"; those concepts are still only theories like vulnerable fates of Drake equation and String theories.
Response: Yes theory, perhaps. But I will still argue that these theories are better-equipped compared to the theory `God did it' . In fact, the hypothesis of God's act is like a `Black magic- abracadabra – it offers no worthwhile explanation for anything, for it simply postulates what we are trying to explain.
Some result of Inflationary cosmology has been verified by the observable fact. Hence it is not as inchoate as you think. I would like to recommend the following books to get the insight:
The Inflationary Universe by Alan Guth
Cosmic Jackpot: Why Our Universe Is Just Right for Life by Paul Davies
Before The Beginning: Our Universe And Others by Martin Rees
God: The Failed Hypothesis. How Science Shows That God Does Not Exist by Victor J Stenger
Has Science Found God? The Latest Results in the Search for Purpose in the Universe by Victor J. Stenger
For Cyclic Universe, you can check :
Endless Universe: Beyond the Big Bang by Paul J. Steinhardt, Neil Turok
Mr. Gani wrote: I also believe that religions have long established institution, family value and morality; important ingredients of human civilization toward humanity.
Response: This is entirely different topic of discussion. I would certainly claim that a non-believer like me is no less moral than you are.
Do Our Values Come from God? The Evidence Says No:
http://www.mukto-mona.com/Articles/vstenger/morality_god.htm
DOES RELIGION DEFINE MORALITY?
http://www.mukto-mona.com/Articles/aparthib/noitikota_aparthib.pdf
http://www.mukto-mona.com/Articles/avijit/odharmiker_dhormokotha221005.pdf
etc.
Mr. Gani wrote: Nevertheless, I must applaud your sincere attention and illustration on my opinions. I hope, distinguished MM readers shall now make up their own dispositions freely.
Response: Agreed. Let the readers be the judge.
Thanks for writing.
Regards
Avijit
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Sign the Petition : Release the Arrested University Teachers Immediately : An Appeal to the Caretaker Government of Bangladesh
http://www.mukto-mona.com/human_rights/university_teachers_arrest.htm
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Daily Star publishes an interview with Mukto-Mona
http://www.mukto-mona.com/news/daily_star/daily_star_MM.pdf
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MM site is blocked in Islamic countries such as UAE. Members of those theocratic states, kindly use any proxy (such as http://proxy.org/) to access mukto-mona.
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Mukto-Mona Celebrates 5th Anniversary
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Mukto-Mona Celebrates Earth Day:
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Kansat Uprising : A Special Page from Mukto-Mona
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MM Project : Grand assembly of local freedom fighters at Raumari
http://www.mukto-mona.com/project/Roumari/freedom_fighters_union300306.htm
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German Bangla Radio Interviews Mukto-Mona Members:
http://www.mukto-mona.com/Special_Event_/Darwin_day/german_radio/
Mukto-Mona Celebrates Darwin Day:
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