Dr. Jiten Roy wrote:
<To Dr. Jaffor Ullah,
<You are referring to me as a "good doctor." You love to taunt people, isn't it? If you noticed, this is the only negative point I have about you. I think I am your best friend, because I have been pointing your drawbacks, ever since I joined this group. You will be a perfect human being, if you could eliminate
this bad habit of yours.>
Jaffor Ullah replies:
It goes to show your paucity in English language. Calling a person "my good man or my good professor" hardly qualifies the address is demeaning or taunting. I have no desire to be "a perfect human being" because it is simply an unattainable goal. I never knew that to be witty is like having a bad habit!
Dr. Jiten Roy wrote:
<You see, I enjoy arguments and counter-arguments. That's debate. Taunting is to provoke the other party. That's cat and mouse game. I cannot do that with you. I still have full respect for you. Your family background is admirable, and you are a great person, no doubt. Let me take the opportunity to introduce myself, as I know you are interested in it.>
Jaffor Ullah replies:
Again, when did I taunt you? By calling you a good doctor? If one ventures out to a public forum, the person hardly has the luxury of having a thin skin. Also, please do not change the definition of liberal and conservative in the middle of a debate. If someone points out the inconsistency, then you think it is an affront to your intelligence. Dr. Roy, you have to stand your ground. When I pointed out to you that Raja Ram Mohan Roy and the rest of Bengali liberals of yesteryears are all truly liberal souls, you just shot back that you are talking about liberal people of the present-day. This is highly objectionable. No liberals worth his salt would engage in a healthy debate with you. One of the ground rules of debate is that you cannot waffle. I was merely pointing out that without liberals, the world cannot make social changes. The old Hindu school of thought believed that it was right to continue widow burning. But it was the liberals who pointed the age-old culture to be abhorrent and disgusting. And you know who won the battle. The person, who talks like a liberal, behaves like a liberal, is a liberal. Therefore, Raja Ram Mohan Roy, members of Thakur family, Keshab Chandra Roy, Iswhar Chandra, Michael Modhusudan Dutta, Bankim Chatterjee, MK Gandhi, and other great souls like them are all liberals. The folks who opposed them and trust me there were many detractors at the time in
Dr. Jiten Roy wrote:
<The following are my guiding principles:
<1. I am not a religious person (in the context of contemporary religions)>
Jaffor replies: Dr. Roy, your name is associated with Hindu organization that prints the holy word
Dr. Jiten Roy wrote:
<2. I do not care about any contemporary religion, which I think is the greatest man made hoax.>
Jaffor Ullah replies:
Please let us know your definition of contemporary religion(s). Throughout human civilization more blood was shed in the name of religion. Dr. Roy, do not be evasive. If you like Hinduism, then say so. Please let Mukto-monas know in what respect your blind belief system is superior to Judaism, Christianity, and say Muslim blind belief system.
Dr. Jiten Roy wrote:
<3. I believe in the human-religion>
<4. I like to preserve my identity (i.e. practice Hindu culture)>
Jaffor Ullah replies:
You mean humanity? In Mukto-mona forum we are promoting the belief system of secular humanism. Will you embrace this philosophy and give up your Hindu identity (from the cultural standpoint). As per old Hindu belief system, once a Hindu takes a sea voyage to occident, he or she becomes a Mleccha (non-Hindu). Raja Ram Mohan Roy went to England in 1831 – two years before his death knowing full-well that he would be ostracized by Hindus in Bengal; however, the great soul embarked on the journey. Come to think of it, as per the age-old conservative view you are no longer a true Hindu. Wouldn't it be proper for you to become an Asian American? If you have such a hang-up of remaining a Hindu (culturally), then pack up and go back to
Dr. Jiten Roy wrote:
<5. I am a conservative (based on the test criterion, mentioned before)>
Jaffor Ullah:
Your definition of conservatism is a narrow one; it's an ill-defined definition at best. Others in Mukto-mona had lambasted you for your myopic mindset as far as the definition of conservative and liberal goes. Need I add more?
Dr. Jiten Roy wrote:
<6. I believe in the freedom of choices (i.e., do not care about other people's way of life as long as they do not interferer with mine)>
Jaffor Ullah replies:
A conservative thinks – "My way or high way." Your definition of the two terms (conservative and liberal) was so whacky that it goes against your assertion that you believe in "freedom of choice." True democrats think in that line. If you are not disturbed as long as others do not shove down your throat their belief system, you say that it is okay. But from your previous post it seems as if those aberrant lifestyles (read homosexuality) greatly bother your mind. Practice what you believe, Dr. Roy? As far as I know, homosexuals, lesbians would hardly visit your home to convince you to become one of them. Should you not leave them alone? Of all folks in Mukto-mona, you are the one who was harping on them.
Dr. Jiten Roy wroye,
<7. I am not an extremist (i.e., follow take it or leave it principle; no intention of imposing my views on others)>
Jaffor Ullah replies:
That is swell, Dr. Roy. However, the tone of your posts paints a picture of you who has great difficulty to empathize with folks whose lifestyles are not exactly yours.
Dr. Jiten Roy wrote:
<8. I am a strong Nationalist (i.e., the country's interest comes first, then me or my community)>
<9. I do not prejudge people (i.e, all people have talents until they prove otherwise)>
<10.I have respect for other people (i.e, follow: Do on to others as you want them to do on to you)>
<Thank you so much, Dr. Ullah, for introducing yourselves to me. It is nice knowing you.>
<Jiten Roy>
Jaffor replies:
It is good to be a nationalist, an open mind and have respects for others. We are not here to judge others whether they are nationalist or who shows respect for others. We are here for debating whether conservatism or liberalism is the best way to serve humanity. Many of us here in Mukto-mona are liberals. However, Mr. Guha and you have stir up the minds of many a liberal by posting your own definition – a very narrow one. I think it was a mistake in my part to engage myself with Mr. Guha in a debate. It is an exercise in futility to debate with Bangladeshi conservatives living in
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Sign the Petition : Release the Arrested University Teachers Immediately : An Appeal to the Caretaker Government of Bangladesh
http://www.mukto-mona.com/human_rights/university_teachers_arrest.htm
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Daily Star publishes an interview with Mukto-Mona
http://www.mukto-mona.com/news/daily_star/daily_star_MM.pdf
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MM site is blocked in Islamic countries such as UAE. Members of those theocratic states, kindly use any proxy (such as http://proxy.org/) to access mukto-mona.
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Mukto-Mona Celebrates 5th Anniversary
http://www.mukto-mona.com/Special_Event_/5_yrs_anniv/index.htm
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Mukto-Mona Celebrates Earth Day:
http://www.mukto-mona.com/Special_Event_/Earth_day2006/index.htm
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Kansat Uprising : A Special Page from Mukto-Mona
http://www.mukto-mona.com/human_rights/kansat2006/members/
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MM Project : Grand assembly of local freedom fighters at Raumari
http://www.mukto-mona.com/project/Roumari/freedom_fighters_union300306.htm
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German Bangla Radio Interviews Mukto-Mona Members:
http://www.mukto-mona.com/Special_Event_/Darwin_day/german_radio/
Mukto-Mona Celebrates Darwin Day:
http://www.mukto-mona.com/Special_Event_/Darwin_day/index.htm
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Some FAQ's about Mukto-Mona:
http://www.mukto-mona.com/new_site/mukto-mona/faq_mm.htm
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VISIT MUKTO-MONA WEB-SITE : http://www.mukto-mona.com/
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"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it".
-Beatrice Hall [pseudonym: S.G. Tallentyre], 190
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